Wednesday, March 4, 2009

Murder-Suicide near Chicago

The Chicago Tribune reports on the case of a man, who shot and killed his wife and son, then turned the gun on himself. That wouldn't make it so unusual, sad to say, but this man had murdered his first wife in 1985 and served 13 years of his 30 year sentence.
Richard Wiley left a 40-page, handwritten suicide note indicating he shot and killed Kathy Motes, 50, and Christopher Motes, 17, and saying he refused to go back to prison, Wilmette police Deputy Chief Brian King said.

At his murder trial, Wiley said he suffered from a rare mental disease called "intermittent explosive disorder," but the judge rejected his claim that he was insane. Wiley reportedly called police himself after the 1985 killing and was found "leaning over the victim, hugging her and crying, 'I'm sorry, I'm sorry.'"

Calling the police and crying over the body sounds perfectly consistent with "intermittent explosive disorder" to me. What do you think? Shouldn't the prison psychiatrists have picked up on something like that? Did his admission and remorse facilitate an early release?

Another thing I find interesting is the frequent refrain, "I'm not going back to prison." In these cases I suppose the deterrent factor of incarceration actually increases the violence. Do you think cases like this are outnumbered by the ones who are genuinely deterred straight?

The murder weapon is always of interest to me. In another fascinating twist to the case, he used a very special weapon. Is there anyone who could deny the fact that the availability of this weapon - what was it, an antique or a collector's item? - played a part.
The murder weapon, found by Wiley's body in a second-floor bedroom, was a black-powder, muzzleloading Civil War replica rifle that may have belonged to Christopher Motes, a Civil War buff, King said.

Wiley apparently had sawed off the barrel of the rifle, which could take several minutes to load because it requires black powder and a metal ball to be loaded through the muzzle, he said.

I'm not sure what that phrase, "which could take several minutes to load because it requires black powder and a metal ball to be loaded through the muzzle," means, unless it's to indicate premeditation and planning. I tend to think he had suffered another of those "explosive episodes," which probably don't subside until blood flows.

What's the enjoyment of these black-powder guns anyway? Is there a sensual pleasure in handling the gun powder and the projectile, actually getting your fingers dirty with the stuff? Is the exhilaration enhanced in firing these weapons, which generally have a stronger recoil than their modern counterparts? Is there something special about the smell of that gunpowder? I'm curious.

What's your opinion? What do you think about this case?

21 comments:

  1. haha. You're definitely an ass.

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  2. I find this very disturbing as the only real gun I have ever fired was a black powder replica of a vintage firearm.
    I found the loading of the charge extremely arousing... sensuously ramming the powder down the barrel of the rifle made my knees buckle with lust and the odor of the powder overcame the synaptic logic of my brain and yes, the gun became one with my, yes...I held it tightly and yes......

    (my apologies to James Joyce)

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  3. Mike,

    Everything is fast becoming a mental disorder. I'm sure given enough time the docs will find one for you, me and everyone else.

    The point is that people like you are causing problems like this. By insisting on treating the "problem" as a mental disease, you and others like you allowed 2 more people to die.

    The man committed murder, should have died for that murder or at least never have gotten out of jail. But because of people like you, he only serve 13/15 years. How does it make you feel to know your actions, your beliefs helped lead to 2 more deaths?

    As far as the challenge of black powder shooting, it is very difficult to do well. Like any skill, mastering it is reward enough.

    As a ex-marine, you had to learn to shoot at distances most people never even try. Do you remember your pride, your enjoyment at mastering that ability?

    As far as availability is concerned, a pipe, black powder (which anyone can make by the way at home) and a marble would have sufficed. So no, once again availability isn't the issue.

    It's people like you allowing murderers to serve just over a decade for killing someone.

    Hope you are taking responsibility for YOUR ACTIONS, YOUR BELIEFS.
    Aren't you part of the flow of these criminals back into society so they can rob/mug/kill again?

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  4. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_mo1-LK3ro

    Note these guys are using pre-loaded paper cartridges, and using flintlock (wheellock? I don't know my vintage BP guns) And this freak could have been using an inline muzzle-loader that takes a standard shotgun primer, but the loading is more-or-less the same (just these guys took the time to pre-measure their powder and wrap them in paper...tho these cartridges are prone to spoilage if not packed in grease)

    Lots of reasons for liking black powder. Since BP burns differently than smokless the firing dynamic is different. I'd say the bulk of BP shooting is done in re-enactments and to hunting. Most locals have a separate black powder season, and hunting with black powder is more difficult than with smokeless cartridges, so many experienced hunters like the challenge.

    Lastly according to the BATFE these are not considered firearms by federal law.

    "What's your opinion? What do you think about this case?"

    I think this guy should have all guns taken away, and sleep on your couch in Rome.

    Also I agree with Potato's assessment. This goes double given that if the man had used a far more deadly tool...a kitchen knife, you wouldn't feel a need to post this story.

    Ass

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  5. Oh and Microdot is an ass too, it appears.

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  6. Bob, You've got me wrong again when you say, "The point is that people like you are causing problems like this. By insisting on treating the "problem" as a mental disease, you and others like you allowed 2 more people to die."

    In my post I said the "prison psychiatrists [should] have picked up on something like that." I didn't mean they should have let him out. He should have been treated for the nut case he is. It's the DOJ that failed, and it's run by people a lot like you, Bob. Don't blame this one on liberals.

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  7. Weer'd, Thanks for sticking around. You happen to be the bearer of the crown formerly worn by Thomas: Most Antagonistic Commenter.

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  8. Sorry Mike, but the DOJ isn't ran by people like me, it is ran by people like US.

    But the court cases, the public perception that criminals are just "poor little mistreated victims" is created, fueled, endorsed and policy based on that perception by people like you.

    Prison psychiatrist shouldn't have caught a guy like this because he should have never been considered for release. He murdered his wife in cold blood.

    People like me want people like him to face the consequences of his actions. People like you want people like him to receive "treatment" and "help" to become once again a productive member of society. I think this case really shows there are some people that can not be a part of society.

    As long as there are people like you insisting on anything less then full accountability and responsibility for his actions, the blood remains on your hands.

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  9. "I think this case really shows there are some people that can not be a part of society"

    Yup, and liberalism is the problem here. Liberals believe that violent criminals can be "rehabilitated" and they are steadfastly against long prison sentences w/o parole.

    The revolving door prison system is largely the fault of liberals. Look at every shithole city in this country. Hell, just look at how Philadelphia treats it's criminals.....

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  10. "Thanks for sticking around. You happen to be the bearer of the crown formerly worn by Thomas: Most Antagonistic Commenter."

    That Crown is yours, and yours alone, Mike. Place it on your brow with your bloodstained hands

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  11. Weer'd Beard said...
    Oh and Microdot is an ass too, it appears.

    Sure they are. And the reason for your delineation is...?

    Let me guess: because they offer an opposing view?

    How's I do?

    By the way, surely I'm in the 'ass' category too, eh Weird?

    Funny stuff. Always a hoot on the right.

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  12. I dunno, was it as good for you as it was more me?

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  13. I dunno, I thought Microdot's comment was sarcasm making fun of Mike B.

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  14. Happiness is a warm gun, yes it is....

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  15. ...but for true satisfaction, you need a belt-fed fully auto.

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  16. Here's an interesting thing in the case. The firearms were 'owned' by the 17 yr old victim. It was stated that he had a FOID card.

    To get one as a minor, it is necessary for a parent/guardian to sign the application for approval and they must also be a FOID card holder. There was no mention of whether the mother had a FOID card or how the 17yr old obtained it.

    They where living in the house w/ a convicted murder and mental patient, allowing him access to firearms.

    Hmmm.

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  17. Bob and Mike W., You know what, I don't think it's true that liberals think criminals are "poor little mistreated victims" and liberals "are steadfastly against long prison sentences w/o parole." I keep hearing you guys saying that about us. I keep hearing you guys putting words in my mouth, words I didn't say.

    In some cases both those statements are true, but not across the board, certainly not in all cases. I'm opposed to the idea of making people completely responsible for their actions when there are major mitigating circumstances, child abuse, addiction, etc. That doesn't mean they get a pass. That simply means those contributing factors are taken into consideration. It's not as simple as black and white, guilt or innocence. We need fair and reasonable judges, neither overly-lenient nor the hang-'em-high type.

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  18. Mike,

    I didn't blame liberals, I blamed people like you. If the shoe fits, etc.

    Make up your mind, this guy tried a mental illness defense and you agreed with him.
    Calling the police and crying over the body sounds perfectly consistent with "intermittent explosive disorder" to me

    On your top post for this morning and in the past you've said

    2. Then, we remove all the alcoholics, drug addicts and mentally ill from prisons and give them the mental health care they need.

    So which is it? You can't have it both ways. People like you are causing problems and have blood on your hands, from letting people like this murderer out and keeping people from defending themselves. Your actions, words and philosophies are killing people Mike.

    What I don't think you and people like you understand is that not all mental illnesses are curable. People can receive treatment all their live and still not be cured. Some people have proven, through their actions - like murder, that they shouldn't be in society.

    By calling for them to be treated as victims, as somebody with a problem instead of criminals you allow them to get out and commit additional crimes. "Illnesses" like pedophilia can not be cured so why should we treat people as if we can cure them?

    I'm opposed to the idea of making people completely responsible for their actions when there are major mitigating circumstances, child abuse, addiction, etc

    This is the biggest piece of victimization excuse making pile of crap I've ever heard. For all the millions of people who have problems, who have addictions, who have suffered major trauma but not committed any crimes, you denigrate their effort.

    Millions of people have problems Mike but they don't murder their wives. Millions of people have addictions but they deal with them and control their actions.

    To excuse those that can't, to say they shouldn't be completely responsible for their actions is incredible. I have an addiction to firearms....if I shot someone, would you not hold me completely responsible for my actions?

    Does it matter if you change the addiction to pornography, gambling, drinking, drugs? NO. People still have to be responsible, completely responsible for their actions.

    Grow up Mike and stop trying to treat the world as if we are children like the child you are acting like.

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  19. First of all, Bob, I took "intermittent explosive disorder" to be a joke. The way it was described in the Chicago Trib sounded to me like a tongue-in-cheek way of saying that the killer was using a preposterous defense, which the judge ruled as such. That's not to say the prison psychiatrists shouldn't have recognized him as dangerous and kept him in. That was my point about this guy.

    Generally, when I say they should get the treatment they need, I mean in a locked mental ward, in some cases for the rest of their lives.

    Stop putting words in my mouth and reading more into what I say than is there.

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  20. Mike,

    You need to pay attention more to the real world and less to your fantasy world.

    intermittent explosive disorder is supposed to be a "valid" mental disorder according to the shrinks. I'm sure the defense had several highly paid shrinks standing by to assure the jury the killer had it.

    The point of the matter is the prison shrinks shouldn't have had to catch it because it shouldn't matter WHY someone decided to kill his wife. Allowing that person back into society after cold bloodedly killing his wife was a mistake. IED or not, it simply should have been a case of the person never getting out of prison.

    It isn't the job of the shrinks to recognize the person as a danger, that was the role of the prosecutor, judge and jury. It was proven that he was a danger, he was convicted of murder. What is a murderer doing getting out of jail in 13 years?????

    Ever thought of the danger of having indefinite psychological treatment as the sentence?

    You get sentenced to jail for a few years.....warned you about making that child porn.....and while in jail the shrinks find you have a mental condition. OOOPPSS instead of getting out in 3 to 5 years, they hold you in jail until you are cured- that could take forever.

    When you depend on the shrinks, everyone becomes a victim and a patient.

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  21. Mike,

    More evidence that your "theory" of firearm availability is completely bogus.

    http://www.examiner.com/x-2879-Austin-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2009m3d5-Mexicos-gun-laws-responsible-for-violent-holocaust

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