"Maybe if Condi Rice's daddy had used some of these tricks, she wouldn't be such a gun rights supporter today."
Or maybe if Johnny and his racist Klan bastards remembered the ONE trick the Klan is most remembered for, lynching, this would have been a different outcome.
Those folks who were harassing the reverend were many despicable things, but they were not murderers. That was not universally true. Many civil rights workers in the South carried guns to protect themselves from the people that were. At least one of the guys in this picture was a civil rights worker in the South during the 50s and 60s, and carried a firearm for protection against the people who weren't just trying to intimidate.
Yup -- I wonder how many African American's went out to deal with the Klan, and before they could make some clever statements (and not all of us are as clever) just ended at the end of a rope. Or died in the fire set as a warning.
It's a fact that when fighting a culture, you need non-violent leaders to turn the hearts of the general populace. Your Ghandi's, your Reverend King's, etc. These are the people who will change the mind of the enemies not lost in hatred.
But while the non-violent heart changing battle goes on there are always others so lost that they'll board a plane full of innocnet people and smash it into a building full of innocent people (wonder if any of the stewards tried joking with them?). Or blow up a truck of outside a Federal building with a daycare (guess none of those kids thought to go out and make a joke to McVeigh). Or plant a bomb in a black church to go off during sunday school and kill children. Or shoot one of those non violent leaders from a hotel room a long distance away.
Changing a culture does take non violent leaders, and they are heros. But short term security takes armed and courageous people while the movement builds (King did not give up on guns until he became a leader).
Condi Rice's father, protecting his community and his children against the Klan, was a man of courage and a hero. Do you not think so? Or would you register his rifle so the cracker sheriff who belongs to the Klan could trump up a charge to take it away the day before their raids?
Lots of comedians are Jewish. Could the German Jews have kidded around with the Nazi brownshirts and thus avoided Kristallnacht and the holocaust (that was sarcasm, BTW).
Jokes are nice, and if they work and you're a big enough person to let it go at that ... awesome! But if the attacker isn't in the joking mood ... a .357 is better.
Lenin also said you should be kind to your mother and old people in general. That he said them doesn't make them wrong.
Many people I respect have made similar statements about an armed people being the final support of true liberty. And the fact that Lenin, a successful and popular revolutionary, said it as well bother's me not in the least. Perhaps the sheer volume of powerful and successful revolutionaries saying such things should be telling you something, because Mike's "detractors" (I prefer the term teachers) have already learned from such statements.
Well ... you nailed me. I didn't really research to see if Lenin said that or not. I don't actually know his opinion on mother's and old people. LOL.
But to spell it out ... Lenin said many things. The fact that he said them doesn't make them not true. I disagree with his politics, but he was a powerful and charismatic leader.
My point was that when so many powerful, successful historical figures agree on something, i.e. your revolutionary hero who said "Only an armed people can be the real bulwark of popular liberty" and my revlolutionary hero who said "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government" you probably ought to pay attention.
So let's see ...
* Thomas Jefferson, along with the rest of the US founding fathers and even Lenin, believed in gun ownership as a force for liberty.
Well, Little Steve, it's not just the internet poster White Rabbit. And I personally would prefer his company to that of the slave owner and misogynist Mr. Jefferson, et al, whom you seem to have canonized.
Always nice to judge 18th century people with 21st century values. Using this method, we pretty much wouldn't want to hang out with anyone who has ever lived.
6 to 8 million people died under Lenin's regime. To protect the newly-established Bolshevik government from counterrevolutionaries and other political opponents, the Bolsheviks created a state security organization, the "Cheka" (Extraordinary Commission), in December 1917.[31] The other Bolsheviks agreed, and instructed Felix Dzerzhinsky, whom Lenin had appointed to head the Cheka in 1917, to commence a "Red Terror", which was officially announced to the public on 1 September 1918, by the Bolshevik newspaper, Krasnaya Gazeta.[44] According to Christopher Read, at this time, due to the assassination attempt by Kaplan, Lenin was lying severely wounded in the hospital and was too ill to advise retaliatory measures.[45] But, according to MI5's official historian at the University of Cambridge, Christopher Andrew, and Richard Pipes, while recovering from his wounds, Lenin instructed: "It is necessary - secretly and urgently to prepare the terror."...The Cheka killed and abused their victims without mercy, says historian Robert Gellately. In his book, Lenin, Stalin, and Hitler: The Age of Social Catastrophe,[50] Gellately, Earl Ray Beck Professor of History at Florida State University, claims that suspected enemies could expect brutal torture, flogging, maiming or execution. Some were shot, others drowned, frozen, buried alive, or hacked to death by swords, and quite often those about to be executed were forced to dig their own graves,
Yet you would rather spend time with him than Jefferson: (from Wikipedia) the principal author of the Declaration of Independence (1776), and one of the most influential Founding Fathers for his promotion of the ideals of republicanism in the United States. Major events during his presidency include the Louisiana Purchase (1803) and the Lewis and Clark Expedition (1804–1806).
As a political philosopher, Jefferson was a man of the Enlightenment and knew many intellectual leaders in Britain and France. He idealized the independent yeoman farmer as exemplar of republican virtues, distrusted cities and financiers, and favored states' rights and a strictly limited federal government. Jefferson supported the separation of church and state[3] and was the author of the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom (1779, 1786). He was the eponym of Jeffersonian democracy and the co-founder and leader of the Democratic-Republican Party, which dominated American politics for a quarter-century. Jefferson served as the wartime Governor of Virginia (1779–1781), first United States Secretary of State (1789–1793), and second Vice President (1797–1801).
A polymath, Jefferson achieved distinction as, among other things, a horticulturist, statesman, architect, archaeologist, paleontologist, inventor, and founder of the University of Virginia. When President John F. Kennedy welcomed forty-nine Nobel Prize winners to the White House in 1962 he said, "I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent and of human knowledge that has ever been gathered together at the White House – with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone."[4] To date, Jefferson is the only president to serve two full terms in office without vetoing a single bill of Congress. Jefferson has been consistently ranked by scholars as one of the greatest of U.S. presidents.
Mike - I came across this quote and thought of you...
ReplyDelete'Only an armed people can be the real bulwark of popular liberty'.
Before your detractors get too excited the quote is from...
Lenin.
:-0
Unfortunately, not all Klansman are disarmed as much by words as Johnny was.
ReplyDelete"Maybe if Condi Rice's daddy had used some of these tricks, she wouldn't be such a gun rights supporter today."
ReplyDeleteOr maybe if Johnny and his racist Klan bastards remembered the ONE trick the Klan is most remembered for, lynching, this would have been a different outcome.
Keep spreading ignorance, Mikey!
Those folks who were harassing the reverend were many despicable things, but they were not murderers. That was not universally true. Many civil rights workers in the South carried guns to protect themselves from the people that were. At least one of the guys in this picture was a civil rights worker in the South during the 50s and 60s, and carried a firearm for protection against the people who weren't just trying to intimidate.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad that you folks all got the message of this piece.
ReplyDeleteMike, thanks for the plug and reposting this!
I reformatted my blog and I lost some of the links I had added in the last few months...
I will relink your blog tonight!
Love the Lenin quote, I guess the comparison of the USA to Tsarist Russia is fashionable now in this SUMMER OF HATE, 2009.
Stay classy, folks.
Yup -- I wonder how many African American's went out to deal with the Klan, and before they could make some clever statements (and not all of us are as clever) just ended at the end of a rope. Or died in the fire set as a warning.
ReplyDeleteIt's a fact that when fighting a culture, you need non-violent leaders to turn the hearts of the general populace. Your Ghandi's, your Reverend King's, etc. These are the people who will change the mind of the enemies not lost in hatred.
But while the non-violent heart changing battle goes on there are always others so lost that they'll board a plane full of innocnet people and smash it into a building full of innocent people (wonder if any of the stewards tried joking with them?). Or blow up a truck of outside a Federal building with a daycare (guess none of those kids thought to go out and make a joke to McVeigh). Or plant a bomb in a black church to go off during sunday school and kill children. Or shoot one of those non violent leaders from a hotel room a long distance away.
Changing a culture does take non violent leaders, and they are heros. But short term security takes armed and courageous people while the movement builds (King did not give up on guns until he became a leader).
Condi Rice's father, protecting his community and his children against the Klan, was a man of courage and a hero. Do you not think so? Or would you register his rifle so the cracker sheriff who belongs to the Klan could trump up a charge to take it away the day before their raids?
Lots of comedians are Jewish. Could the German Jews have kidded around with the Nazi brownshirts and thus avoided Kristallnacht and the holocaust (that was sarcasm, BTW).
Jokes are nice, and if they work and you're a big enough person to let it go at that ... awesome! But if the attacker isn't in the joking mood ... a .357 is better.
Duh.
White Rabbit ...
ReplyDeleteLenin also said you should be kind to your mother and old people in general. That he said them doesn't make them wrong.
Many people I respect have made similar statements about an armed people being the final support of true liberty. And the fact that Lenin, a successful and popular revolutionary, said it as well bother's me not in the least. Perhaps the sheer volume of powerful and successful revolutionaries saying such things should be telling you something, because Mike's "detractors" (I prefer the term teachers) have already learned from such statements.
But thanks for playing ...
Sebastian, Thanks so much for that wonderful picture. It certainly includes some heavyweight figures in the gun-rights movement, including yourself.
ReplyDeleteBut, which one was in the south during the civil rights turmoil? I'm guessing David Hardy.
If Wade Watts is anything like most Okies, don't think for a moment he didn't have "backup" in case his tricks didn't work.
ReplyDeleteJoe Olsen, in the middle. Hardy is a bit to young, I think.
ReplyDeleteLittle Steve said...
ReplyDelete"Lenin also said you should be kind to your mother and old people in general".
Prove it.
White Rabbit ...
ReplyDeleteWell ... you nailed me. I didn't really research to see if Lenin said that or not. I don't actually know his opinion on mother's and old people. LOL.
But to spell it out ... Lenin said many things. The fact that he said them doesn't make them not true. I disagree with his politics, but he was a powerful and charismatic leader.
My point was that when so many powerful, successful historical figures agree on something, i.e. your revolutionary hero who said "Only an armed people can be the real bulwark of popular liberty" and my revlolutionary hero who said "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government" you probably ought to pay attention.
So let's see ...
* Thomas Jefferson, along with the rest of the US founding fathers and even Lenin, believed in gun ownership as a force for liberty.
* Internet poster "white rabbit" does not.
I'm thinkin' I'm going with Jefferson et al.
Well, Little Steve, it's not just the internet poster White Rabbit. And I personally would prefer his company to that of the slave owner and misogynist Mr. Jefferson, et al, whom you seem to have canonized.
ReplyDeleteAlways nice to judge 18th century people with 21st century values. Using this method, we pretty much wouldn't want to hang out with anyone who has ever lived.
ReplyDeleteNow we know,
ReplyDelete6 to 8 million people died under Lenin's regime.
To protect the newly-established Bolshevik government from counterrevolutionaries and other political opponents, the Bolsheviks created a state security organization, the "Cheka" (Extraordinary Commission), in December 1917.[31]
The other Bolsheviks agreed, and instructed Felix Dzerzhinsky, whom Lenin had appointed to head the Cheka in 1917, to commence a "Red Terror", which was officially announced to the public on 1 September 1918, by the Bolshevik newspaper, Krasnaya Gazeta.[44] According to Christopher Read, at this time, due to the assassination attempt by Kaplan, Lenin was lying severely wounded in the hospital and was too ill to advise retaliatory measures.[45] But, according to MI5's official historian at the University of Cambridge, Christopher Andrew, and Richard Pipes, while recovering from his wounds, Lenin instructed: "It is necessary - secretly and urgently to prepare the terror."...The Cheka killed and abused their victims without mercy, says historian Robert Gellately. In his book, Lenin, Stalin, and Hitler: The Age of Social Catastrophe,[50] Gellately, Earl Ray Beck Professor of History at Florida State University, claims that suspected enemies could expect brutal torture, flogging, maiming or execution. Some were shot, others drowned, frozen, buried alive, or hacked to death by swords, and quite often those about to be executed were forced to dig their own graves,
Yet you would rather spend time with him than Jefferson:
(from Wikipedia)
the principal author of the Declaration of Independence (1776), and one of the most influential Founding Fathers for his promotion of the ideals of republicanism in the United States. Major events during his presidency include the Louisiana Purchase (1803) and the Lewis and Clark Expedition (1804–1806).
As a political philosopher, Jefferson was a man of the Enlightenment and knew many intellectual leaders in Britain and France. He idealized the independent yeoman farmer as exemplar of republican virtues, distrusted cities and financiers, and favored states' rights and a strictly limited federal government. Jefferson supported the separation of church and state[3] and was the author of the Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom (1779, 1786). He was the eponym of Jeffersonian democracy and the co-founder and leader of the Democratic-Republican Party, which dominated American politics for a quarter-century. Jefferson served as the wartime Governor of Virginia (1779–1781), first United States Secretary of State (1789–1793), and second Vice President (1797–1801).
A polymath, Jefferson achieved distinction as, among other things, a horticulturist, statesman, architect, archaeologist, paleontologist, inventor, and founder of the University of Virginia. When President John F. Kennedy welcomed forty-nine Nobel Prize winners to the White House in 1962 he said, "I think this is the most extraordinary collection of talent and of human knowledge that has ever been gathered together at the White House – with the possible exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone."[4] To date, Jefferson is the only president to serve two full terms in office without vetoing a single bill of Congress. Jefferson has been consistently ranked by scholars as one of the greatest of U.S. presidents.
Now, that is pathetic