Saturday, March 7, 2015

More on the Proposed Ammo Ban

Washington Examiner link from George Jefferson

A top police representative on Tuesday said that there is no history of criminals using a round popular among AR-15 rifle shooters against officers, undermining the Obama administration's argument for banning the 5.56 M855 "lightgreen tip."

"Any ammunition is of concern to police in the wrong hands, but this specific round has historically not posed a law enforcement problem," said James Pasco, executive director of the Washington office of the Fraternal Order of Police, the world's largest organization of sworn law enforcement officers, with more than 325,000 members.
He told Secrets that the round used mostly for target practice "is not typically used against law enforcement."

While he said that he is "not finding fault" with the surprise move last month by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to classify the round as "armor piercing" and then ban it, Pasco added, "While this round will penetrate soft body armor, it has not historically posed a threat to law enforcement."

That view not only counters BATFE's reason for proposing the ban, it also challenges the White House endorsement of the ban. Spokesman Josh Earnest said Monday, "we are looking at additional ways to protect our brave men and women in law enforcement and believe that this process is valuable for that reason alone. This seems to be an area where everyone should agree that if there are armor-piercing bullets available that can fit into easily concealed weapons, that it puts our law enforcement at considerably more risk."

The administration's effort is under fire on Capitol Hill where 55 percent of all House members have signed a letter challenging BATFE's proposal.

Many gun enthusiasts believe that the proposed bullet ban, up for public comment, is a backdoor bid to cut the popularity of the AR-15, the nation's most popular gun, one critics call an "assault weapon" and a target of liberals and President Obama.


  1. This entire ban proposal is based on lies on top of lies. The BATFE claims that the green tip ammo was acceptable when it came out in 1986, because the only commercially available pistols chambered in 5.56x45mm NATO/.223 Remington at the time were single shot target/hunting guns, and thus not a substantial threat to law enforcement officers--as if they think we're too stupid to realize that Bushmaster offered a semi-automatic, detachable magazine-fed pistol in that caliber from 1977 to 1990.

    Did you guys check out this gem from the filthy vermin Josh Sugarmann?

    Opponents also allege that no law-enforcement officer has been shot with one of the cartridges fired from a handgun. Testing the veracity of that assertion is challenging, but the whole point of the ban on "armor-piercing" ammunition is to prevent law enforcement and first responders who rely on body armor from ever having to face assailants wielding handguns loaded with armor-piercing rounds.

    In other words, "Just because the 'threat' this ban supposedly counters has never materialized in the 29 years this ammunition has been on the market is no reason to not ban it without any statutory authority."

    1. No, Kurt, that's not it at all. "Testing the veracity of that assertion is challenging" means you cannot say a cop shot while wearing a vest "has never materialized in the 29 years this ammunition has been on the market."

    2. That "testing the veracity of that assertion is challenging," is the closest Sugarmann could come to sufficient integrity to admit, "We got nuthin'."

      Sugarmann himself admits that, "As a result, according to Federal Bureau of Investigation data, since 1987 only one law-enforcement officer has been killed by handgun ammunition that penetrated body armor."

      I kinda imagine that had the round involved been an M855, or even any other.223/5.56mm. Sugarmann would have found the "veracity" to be much more easily tested.

      Even the BATFE's explanation of why the ban is needed never cites the "threat" claimed here ever having happened.

      Nope--this proposed ban purports to address a "threat" that has been nothing more than silly, fear mongering fantasy for the decades that this ammo has been on the market.

  2. Well, looks like the ATF has backed off, for now,

    "The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is shelving a controversial proposal to ban a popular type of bullet, amid opposition from hundreds of congressional lawmakers.
    The ATF said in a statement on Tuesday it would not seek to issue the final guidelines "at this time." The proposal pertained to M855 "green tip" ammunition, used in the AR-15 rifle; regulators looked at banning it because can pierce police body armor.
    The ATF said in a statement on Tuesday it would not seek to issue final guidelines "at this time." The agency said it will instead wait until Americans have finished commenting on the federal regulations and evaluate their comments and suggestions before "proceeding with any framework."

    Of course, "at this time" means, ""stay tuned"

    1. You beat me to it, SSG. This is fabulous news, and I don't even mind having to stand down my preparations for if the ban had gone through.