And, actually I don't think we finished discussing this one. There was a bit of an e-mail kerfuffle. It seems Weer'd felt my post was bordering on slander.
This post borders on slander. I respectfully request you remove it.I politely said no and asked what exactly was the part which bordered on slander. No response.
And of course there are two timeless posts which can always use further discussion, here and here.
Have a nice break MikeB.
ReplyDeleteHopefully in your absence some more draconian laws will be overturned so you will have plenty to complain about upon your return.
JadeGold version: MikeB's time off is a myth, urban legend, didn't happen.
The plan, 2006:
ReplyDeleteVenezuela Announces Gun Control Plan to Lower Crime
July 3rd 2006, by Michael Fox – Venezuelanalysis.com
http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/news/1812
Caracas, Venezuela, July 2, 2006--The Venezuelan Ministry of Justice announced the creation of a new firearms control plan on Wednesday, in an attempt to decrease excessive violence in Venezuela. The plan will be presented to Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez in two weeks, and could begin to be implemented by the end of July.
The National Weapons Control Plan was announced by the Minister of Justice and Interior, Jesse Chacon, who proclaimed it to be an important piece of the larger security policies that the Ministry of Interior and Justice has been developing.
“We are going to get the ball rolling on this disarmament plan in order to take all of those [weapons] that are found to be illegal out of circulation and this will be presented in two weeks to the President of the Republic, Hugo Chavez, for consideration for its implementation.” Announced Chacon. “By the end of July, we expect to be able to count on a complete registry of the whole range of weapons that are out there, as much in the security organizations as well as in the hands of the civilian population.”
According to Minister Chacon, the plan has two strategic goals: disarmament and weapons control. Under disarmament, the plan is to destroy all of the excess, legal or illegal, weapons in the country, whether captured or turned in voluntarily. The weapons control plan attempts to bring about the registration of all of Venezuela’s weapons.
“The disarmament is in order to take out of circulation that quantity of illegal guns that are now found in Venezuela and to implement mechanisms in order to bring about not just the registration of the weaponry that is found in Venezuela, but also the use of it,” announced Chacon.
The results, 2010:
Venezuela murder-rate quadrupled under Chavez: NGO
Reuters -- Thursday, March 11, 2010
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/11/AR2010031102490.html
CARACAS (Reuters) - Homicides in Venezuela have quadrupled during President Hugo Chavez's 11 years in power, with two people murdered every hour, according to new figures from a non-governmental organization.
The Venezuelan Observatory of Violence (OVV), whose data is widely followed in the absence of official statistics, said the South American nation has one of the highest crime rates on the continent, with 54 homicides per 100,000 citizens in 2009.
FishyJay, Thanks for that story about Venezuela. I wrote about Caracas last year one time.
ReplyDeleteMaybe in this case you guys will finally have that example you've been looking for in which the oppressive government takes all the guns away and true tyranny sets in.
I know England was a terrible disappointment for you.
Enjoy the break! It's nice to step away from the Interwebs every now and then.
ReplyDeleteMikeB: “Maybe in this case you guys will finally have that example you've been looking for in which the oppressive government takes all the guns away and true tyranny sets in.
ReplyDeleteI know England was a terrible disappointment for you.”
No one said tyranny is guaranteed to happen in the UK. We did say crime would go up with massive gun bans. Now that must be a terrible disappointment for you.
-TS
TS, Not to quibble, but some people do say exactly that. Gun control leads to gun confiscations and that leads to tyranny.
ReplyDeleteAbout the rise in crime, I've seen quite a few conflicting reports about that. I don't think it's a clear cut as some people like to pretend.
"...Not to quibble, but some people do say exactly that. Gun control leads to gun confiscations and that leads to tyranny."
ReplyDeleteWell, some people might say that, but they have their words a little mixed up. People who say that gun control will lead to confiscations and tyranny are probably the same people who use "then" when they mean "than" and don't know the difference between the word "effect" and "affect."
Gun control can lead to confiscation, and many times has. To say that it will lead to confiscation is simply not possible to know. Based upon numerous examples in the past, it certainly becomes a greater possibility.
As for tyranny, I would argue that tyranny leads to gun control, not the other way around. But that's just me and my view of government interference in people's lives.
MikeB: “TS, Not to quibble, but some people do say exactly that. Gun control leads to gun confiscations and that leads to tyranny.”
ReplyDeleteI usually see the stance “tyranny can be resisted with guns” or “gun confiscations have to happen before tyranny can set it”, etc… You are saying people have claimed “Tyranny will absolutely set in after major gun confiscations, AND it will happen within 15 years.” 15 years being the timeframe that we are at right now. Tyranny can be a long slow process, you know. I would like to see you find a quote of someone taking the hard stance, but that wouldn’t mean we all think that. Look, I think it is highly unlikely with or without gun confiscations- but it is more likely with the confiscations. Besides, I don’t think the UK is a tyranny, but it is not the kind of free society that I would like to live in.
MikeB: “About the rise in crime, I've seen quite a few conflicting reports about that. I don't think it's a clear cut as some people like to pretend.”
You mean like Henigan’s conflicting reports that crime is up here? What is clear is that it didn’t work in the UK. Gun confiscations were not the answer as there was no major drop off in crime. It is just as violent a place as it was before. We can agree on that, right?
-TS