In fact, I've noticed that whenever anyone who is a gun owner comes out for anything which might be remotely considered to be "reasonable" the gunloons shoot him down (e.g., background checks). I can give you examples of Smith and Wesson's agreement with the Clinton Administration where S & W agreed agreed to were; to sell guns with locks, to build the locks in the weapons within two years, implement smart gun technology, and take ballistic fingerprints of its guns. Or Former Field and Stream Editor, Dick Metcalf Supporting gun control with this statement:
“I bring this up,” he wrote, “because way too many gun owners still believe that any regulation of the right to keep and bear arms is an infringement. The fact is that all Constitutional rights are regulated, always have been, and need to be.”The pro-gun side will call the people who admit the US has a serious problem with firearms all sorts of nasty name: including "sheeple". Bus, isn't the term "sheeple" referring to people who follow and don't think? Isn't it implying a certain amount of intellectual dishonesty?
Anyway, I bet you wouldn't guess that I was once one of the gun rights fold?
Yep, serious gun rights. Maybe on the verge of militia movement. What happened?
I grew up.
First off, I'm probably a LOT better traveled than most of you. And guess what? Lots of other countries have guns! Yeah, they do.
As for the Second Amendment, I actually looked into it and its history. I didn't bother with the books by the pseudo-scholars. Does the term taking things out of context have any meaning to you? trust me, that is what they do. And if you think for yourself, you will see that. For example:
The current gun control debate has resurrected a quote allegedly from George Washington that goes like this: "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government.” The quote is floating around on Facebook and on various anti-gun control blogs like "Ammunition Depot" and "Famous Second Amendment Quotes." Sometimes the quote has a source, usually the Boston Independent Chronicle, January 14, 1790 but usually is just attributed nakedly to George Washington.
The actual quote comes from Washington's address to Congress on January 8th, 1790 and goes like this: "A free people ought not only to be armed, but disciplined; to which end a Uniform and well digested plan is requisite: And their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories, as tend to render them independent others, for essential, particularly for military supplies." Note that the quote has nothing to do with gun rights and is clearly concerns properly equipping the military.That is not a unique example of how the gun rights crowd distort the Second Amendment historical roots.
Anyway,you need to go beyond your own comfort zone here. Because if you really want to believe in the gun rights version of the Second Amendment, because that's the way you want it to read, then you are going to have a serious problem dealing with the truth. But, that's what the gun rights people want you to do--accept lies.
You are going to actually have to read the primary sources and do some historical research on your own.
It requires actually thinking for yourself.
Let's toss in a well meaning home maker who lived near my mother getting murdered. Not really anyone who was close to my family, other than she lived near my mother. Then, there are too many other innocent people who get shot. They may not die, but they drain on the public's resources.
Is my having a gun really that important? Is it rally the best method of home defence?
Anyway, I have really looked into this topic. I have considered most of your arguments and found them to not be valid. Especially if the only reason why you believe in gun rights is that is the way you want it to be.
Life is tough, man, grow up if you just want your guns because...
So, I am not really an "anti-gun bigot". If I were bigoted, I would still be on the "pro-gun" side.
Great post!
ReplyDeleteMerca loves to live the lies from the 1%. Real monkeys can think and learn. Ours can not.
Capitalism will NEVER be denied.
Look at the people who support gun control. The leaders are precisely the One Percent. That's what gun control is about, keeping the rest of us submissive.
DeleteYou must be hittin' the bong, Greg. Now the gun control movement is aligned with the richest 1% who are keeping the rest of us down.
DeleteNope, I don't touch the stuff. But let's see:
DeleteMichael Bloomberg, George Soros, a long list of celebrities, Dianne Feinstein isn't hurting for cash, the list goes on.
Look at the racists who promote guns. Ted Nugent ! Our own Greg who is a lying criminal coward.
DeleteGreg, I really think this is one of your dumber arguments, and that's saying something.
DeleteNo, Mikeb, you just don't like having to admit that you support a position that gives advantage to the wealthy. They can afford bodyguards, and they can always get gun licenses. You've been shown the evidence for that many times.
DeleteI suppose the members of the new fastest growing gun control group, The Moms, are all proud inhabitants of the 1% then?
DeleteDo you see how stupid your argument is?
Powerful people always have sychophants and lickspittles around them. Look at the popularity of celebrity magazines, for example.
DeleteWait a minute, didn't I call you a sycophant just last week. Now you're calling me a sycophant. Don't you get tired of acting so immaturely?
DeleteNo, I'm calling the Moms Demand Gun Bans sychophants and lickspittles.
DeleteOf course you would call the "MOMS" sick names, they care about the lives of children, you don't.
DeleteI knew this was one of Laci's posts from the start. It's condescending and filled with half-truths
ReplyDeleteThanks for the laugh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeletePeople who read an individual right to own arms either don't know how to read 18th century English, or are simply lying to ensure a right to own arms. Lying is a trait proven to be used by gun loons.
ReplyDeleteYes it is, and with good reason.
DeleteExcept that we have a judicial system to interpret the Constitution. It's called the US Supreme Court. Last I checked, the most recent decisions go with the individual right way of thinking.
DeleteI'm sorry that you two can't read good English, and I've tried to educate you. But I'm still waiting for proof about any lies that the gun-rights commenters have made here.
DeleteThe lie that's it's rare for a gun to go off when it is dropped.
DeleteNext lie cowardly criminal liar.
Anonymous, I'm taking the opinion of experts in the subject. But perhaps you're unaware that the State of California does drop tests and only approves firearms that pass? Many guns are banned for other reasons, but here's the list that passed the test:
Deletehttp://certguns.doj.ca.gov/safeguns_resp.asp
Greg, are you really quoting a regulation from California to make your point, California which has the strictest gun laws in the country and which is continually demonized by you? Is that what you're doing really?
DeleteOne might think you're up to your old tricky bullshit again. Do you think they do those "drop tests" in Montana or Mississippi?
Proving some guns pass a drop test does not negate your statement that guns do not go off when dropped, when there is plenty of evidence to the contrary. Yours is a dishonest attempt to prove something that is a lie. No surprise from the site liar.
DeleteMikeb, I'm showing a long list of guns that are drop safe. Yes, I oppose California's repressive gun laws, but they've done the testing, and I'll use those results, since I don't challenge their methods in this regard.
DeleteProving again that you are the site criminal lying coward. Your list does not support your statement that dropped guns going off, is rare. Just another attempt to divert from the question you have been found lying about.
DeleteYeah, you're all over the place on this one, Greg.
DeleteMikeb, what that list shows is that in the judgement of the State of California, there is a long list of firearms that will not go off when dropped, barring some mechanical defect in the particular gun in question. How is that hard for you to understand?
DeleteYes, and that was never the point site liar. You and ss said it was rare for a gun to fire when dropped, which simply is not true. Now you present a list of guns that have been tested for not firing when dropped. Truly a dishonest attempt to change the subject. Expected from you the sites criminal lying coward.
Delete"I know that the usual gunloon belief is that people who are "anti-gun" have no experience of firearms, hate guns, or are just "bigoted against guns"."
ReplyDelete"The pro-gun side will call the people who admit the US has a serious problem with firearms all sorts of nasty name: including "sheeple". Bus, isn't the term "sheeple" referring to people who follow and don't think?"
Tell me Laci, have you noticed that you seem to be doing the same thing that you accuse the progun side to be doing? How exactly can you complain about the progun side referring to those in favor of gun control as "sheeple" when you seem quite comfortable calling those on the progun side gunloons?
"In fact, I've noticed that whenever anyone who is a gun owner comes out for anything which might be remotely considered to be "reasonable" the gunloons shoot him down (e.g., background checks). "
ReplyDeleteThere are many special interest groups that fight fiercely for whatever cause they are devoted to, sometimes seemingly pushing the limits of common sense. For example, those who so strongly oppose any kind of restriction in regards to reproductive choice. Or any limitations in regards to free speech or privacy.
So in this case, there are individuals and groups that do the same for gun rights.
What Laci didn't tell us in this article is about his experiences as part of the army of occupation of Northern Ireland. He's bragged about that in the past, but been rather quiet on the subject of late.
DeleteWhen was the last time a gun loon came out with any reasonable, rational idea. Be specific.
DeleteName something reasonable a gun loon has come out for?
DeleteAnswer a question with a question. The oldest dodge move in history. A clear sign you cannot answer the question. Thank you for proving that.
DeleteNational carry license reciprocity is a rational idea. Allowing the Assault Weapons Ban to end was a rational idea. Protecting our gun rights is a rational idea.
DeleteSince tens of millions disagree with every point you made, they are not reasonable, just what YOU want. But you are a proven liar, so I give your comments the respect they deserve, NONE.
DeletePooch, you weasel. The word uniform isn't capitalized and doesn't mean what you are trying to make it mean.
ReplyDeleteWhat does GW say? "A free people ought not ONLY to be armed Which means what? The citizens SHOULD BE ARMED!! Not only that, but also have Military supplies.
orlin sellers.
Ha, Laci! If only I had a dollar for every time some gunloon has called me "afraid" of guns, or suggested that if only I would go to a gun range, I would change my opinion, or even offering to take me out shooting with them! These dolts have no idea that I grew up with guns, that my dad was a gun collector and hunter, and that I shot many guns, including an assault rifle, before I grew up, too (too soon, when gun violence affected me personally). They live in a black-powder-filled bubble fueled by their own fetish.
ReplyDeleteWe know you're hopeless, but you got to shoot an assault rifle? Who did you know with a full-auto gun?
DeleteWhile in high school, I was in rifle club. I would bring my rifle to school (THIS IS TRUE) and store it in the office. After school, we would go to the police rifle range. We would shoot our guns, and get NRA badges. I got to Marksman 2nd class, despite the amazing inaccuracy of the ancient rifle that I had.\
ReplyDeleteHowever, I do not own a gun now, and have no interest in penis extension or in testosterone support. I am a man. I do not need artificial support. I am not a dickless weinie like the NRA members.
So in highschool you needed this penis extension?
DeleteTalk to a gun control freak long enough, and out come the penis jokes.
DeleteYou started the penis jokes on this site, they are taking your lead.
ReplyDeleteAnon, if you look a little higher, you'll see that Nick started it on this thread. And of course Baldr threw in with his favorite term "fetish"
ReplyDeleteAnother lie. Check the archives, Greg started the penis jokes a long time ago.
Delete"Another lie. Check the archives, Greg started the penis jokes a long time ago."
ReplyDeleteWell, I originally was referring to this particular post, but lets look. I did a search for Greg Camp and didn't come up with anything prior to Nov. 2011. Perhaps Greg can enlighten us when he started commenting here.
I did a search for penis and the earliest I got was a posting in July of 2012 written by Dog Gone.
http://mikeb302000.blogspot.com/2012/07/for-those-who-have-confronted-their.html#uds-search-results
I did a search for compensating and came up with a comment by Rob way back in 2009.
http://mikeb302000.blogspot.com/2009/10/guns-on-michigan-campuses.html
Then we had a comment from an Anon who signed as Jadegold in 2010,
"BTW, the big Tim McVeigh Celebration Day on the shores of the Potomac was pretty sparsely attended. It looks like about 30 domestic terrorists showed up; there were probably more media people in attendance than actual members of the small penis brigade.
--JadeGold"
http://mikeb302000.blogspot.com/2010/04/nyt-on-loophole.html
In 2010, Jadegold got to post on the blog and in Dec.2010 posted a penis gun. Seems to like those. (no comment)
http://mikeb302000.blogspot.com/2010/12/xmas-shopping-tip.html
Do you possibly have a link showing Greg discussing these male appendages earlier than that? Otherwise, I think the prize goes to Jadegold representing your side. But then maybe I'm working the search function wrong here.
My observation is that most of the mentions of "the penis joke" are from pro-gun guys accusing us of doing that all the time or some other exaggerated victim bullshit. Often these mentions are like the one Greg did recently, with no mention of it from us.
DeleteI'm done searching since I have done that many times and Greg denies anyways. He denies his own words. Can't debate dishonesty like that, or yours.
ReplyDelete