We often hear the expression "lethal threat" in gun discussions. Almost everyone seems to agree that "lethal threat" is the major criterion, among others, for determining whether a defensive gun use is justified. But, how frequent do these occur?
My contention is they are not frequent at all, and here's how I arrived at that.
Without offering autobiographical details, I can safely say I've been around the block a few times. I've lived in a number of places, some of them not so savory. I've associated with many different types of people, some of them not so savory. I've been in some of the most dangerous places in North America, Harlem, Newark and Tijuana. I'm 56 years old, and looking back, do you know how many incidents of lethal threat to myself or someone in my vicinity I've seen? None, not a single one.
The problem is however, I have experienced first-hand about 10 or 20 situations that could have been interpreted as such. If I had always carried a concealed weapon and had always been prepared to protect myself and others from serious danger, there would have been bloodshed on a number of occasions, not one of which, I now see, truly merited that response.
This is the problem with concealed carry permits. The folks who have them, for the most part are not capable of making the lightning fast decisions which are necessary in a critical situation. They will err on the side of caution, not wanting to endanger their own lives, and they will get away with it especially if the only other witness is a wounded or dead criminal.
A good example is Caleb who writes Gun Nuts Media. When confronted with a knife-bearing criminal, he diverted the man's attention, drew his gun and the would-be mugger ran off. My hat's off to Caleb for demonstrating exactly the restraint and cool-headed response that was called for, nothing more. But how many gun owners can do that? What if the threat had been slightly greater? What if Caleb had shot the guy dead?
So, my conclusions are these. DGUs are rare and legitimate DGUs are even rarer.
What's your opinion? Please leave a comment.
" The folks who have them, for the most part are not capable of making the lightning fast decisions which are necessary in a critical situation."
ReplyDeleteThat's a mighty big claim with very little proof.
"So, my conclusions are these. DGUs are rare and legitimate DGUs are even rarer."
And an even bigger claim with even less proof.
Actually, Caleb stopped the threat with his coffee in the mugger's face. He drew the gun and then became the aggressor in that incident. Although, there is a next to zero likelihood that he would be charged for assault.
ReplyDeleteTo be quite honest, Caleb would have been better off using pepper spray. Pepper spray would have incapacitated the perp and allowed police a chance to catch him.
The criminal Caleb "stopped" learned a lesson: the next time he will have a gun and may use it.
AztecRed, MikeB's claims are backed up by the stats which contradict Lott and Kleck. Not to mention that Lott and Kleck are discredited.
Pepper spray would have incapacitated the perp and allowed police a chance to catch him.
ReplyDeleteSpoken like someone who's totally ignorant. People can fight through pepper spray (cops are sprayed with it for that very reason) Other people are not affected by it AT ALL. I know, I've seen people hit with it.
To say that "pepper spray WOULD HAVE incapacitated him." Is not just ignorant, it is beyond stupid and flatly incorrect.
So does rape count as a "deadly threat"? With 33% of women in America being sexually assaulted at some point in their life, does rape count?
ReplyDeleteIf 1 in 3 women are at risk of rape, how do they level the playing field?
There are almost 750,000 sexual assaults upon women yearly in the US. While as an adult male, YOU might have avoided "deadly threats" 750,000 woman are not able to do so EVERY YEAR!
Laci, I'm sorry, but most criminals of the type that assaulted Caleb DON'T resort to guns, for whatever reason.
A gun is the great leveler of the playing field.
Answer Joe's "Just One Question", before you become an authority:
"Can you demonstrate one time or place, throughout all history, where the average person was made safer by restricting access to handheld weapons?"
Gee MikeB, 10 or 20 situations that if you were "packing" there would have been bloodshed? Can you recount even five?
ReplyDeleteYou come across like some "worldly" man. I bet you would scream like a little girl if you ever got into any kind of a scrape or ever confronted by someone who intended you harm.
Your're a phony
"AztecRed, MikeB's claims are backed up by the stats which contradict Lott and Kleck. Not to mention that Lott and Kleck are discredited."
ReplyDeleteWhat stats would that be?
VOR, I won't recount anything to you. You've got me pegged for a phony do you, as one who would scream like a girl?
ReplyDeleteHow did you arrive at that? Is it just a "feeling" you have? Or are you just trying to insult me in some glib way you think will piss me off?
How many times have you had to defend youself over the last year? Do you carry a gun everywhere you go? Do you have any concrete reasons for owning a gun, or are you just convinced that you might someday need it and you know what they say, it's better to not need a gun and have one than to need one and not have it. That would be a "feeling" then right, sort of like the "feeling" you have about me.
bwaites said, "So does rape count as a "deadly threat"? With 33% of women in America being sexually assaulted at some point in their life, does rape count?"
ReplyDeleteI think you'd like one of my earlier posts which was very popular with the pro-gun crowd.
Laci, A couple guys picked up on the "pepper spray" part of your comment, but not the part about Caleb becoming the aggressor. I think you're on to somehting. I don't remember the story right now but I guess if the mugger was deterred by the coffee the gun was unnecessary. Drawing it may very well have been too agressive. That would make this another example of an improper gun use dressed up as a DGU.
ReplyDeleteBullshit MikeB.
ReplyDeleteCaleb called the cops immediately after the incident. If he was the "aggressor" as you claim then why didn't the cops arrest him?
How come you claim we gun owners are guilty even when the facts of the situation are otherwise?
What's your problem with reality?
Mike W. said to me, "If he was the "aggressor" as you claim..."
ReplyDeleteThis is what you like to do, exaggerate what I said and argue against that.
What I said was to Laci, "you may be on to something." I went on to say "IF" the coffee had deterred the mugger and "it very well may have been too aggressive." All of these remarks are a far cry from what you said. My observations could open up a discussion about the exact moment of deterrence and when aggression begins. I didn't "claim" anything.