The article goes on to offer an explanation behind the efforts of Congressman Tiahrt.As a candidate, Barack Obama promised to get rid of a law - quietly passed by Congress - that hides information from the public about guns used in crimes and the stores that sell them.
Instead, President Obama has embraced most of the law and added even more rules that could make it harder for law enforcement to crack down on dealers and stores selling guns to criminals.
While supporters of the secrecy law say shielding crime-gun data and dealer violations protects police officers, Milwaukee Police Chief Edward Flynn labels that notion "a crock."
In fact, Flynn said he didn't get a clear picture of what role West Milwaukee's Badger Guns plays in selling crime guns that end up in his city until six police officers were shot in a two-year span - all with guns from Badger Guns or its predecessor, Badger Outdoors.
Before the law passed, it was easier to see such trends and Badger Outdoors ranked at the top, according to the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. In 2005 alone, the store sold 537 crime guns - most in the nation.
U.S. Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.), who is the second-largest congressional recipient of National Rifle Association cash, said his legislation - commonly referred to as "Tiahrt" (pronounced TEE-heart) - is intended to protect undercover officers.
Flynn called the congressman's rationale for the law "a cynical fig leaf."
"Tiahrt was enacted after the ATF published reports telling everyone who the irresponsible gun dealers are. Suddenly officer safety was at risk? That is a crock," Flynn said. "It is sad, sad, sad that Congress is willing to endure this language and continue to be a willful accomplice in the arming of criminals with high-quality firearms."
By putting it in a budget bill, Tiahrt assured his measure would be passed without a separate up or down vote. Seven years later, there still hasn't been one.
What's your opinion? Do you think Milwaukee Police Chief Edward Flynn is one of those deluded gun control nuts who are afraid of inanimate objects?
No, I wouldn't think so. I would imagine he knows what he's talking about. It sounds to me like this was a dirty deal paid for by the NRA, one that does far more harm than good.
What's your opinion? Please leave a comment.
"What's your opinion? Do you think Milwaukee Police Chief Edward Flynn is one of those deluded gun control nuts who are afraid of inanimate objects?"
ReplyDeleteYes, pretty obvious.
and added even more rules that could make it harder for law enforcement to crack down on dealers and stores selling guns to criminals.
ReplyDeleteI think that this article is misrepresenting the Tiahrt Amendment. When conducting criminl investigations law enforcement still has access to the same trace data that they previously had.
Setting the record straight about firearms trace data
ReplyDeleteBy MICHAEL J. SULLIVAN
Monday, April 30, 2007
During the past several weeks, numerous questions and articles have arisen in the media, regarding the ability of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives to share firearms trace data among members of the law-enforcement community. With the recent tragic events surrounding the senseless criminal use of firearms; I felt the need to clarify this important issue.
Firearms trace data is critically important information developed by ATF to assist state and local law-enforcement in investigating and solving violent crimes. This data tracks the transfer of a firearm from the manufacturer to the gun's first purchaser, and can assist law enforcement in ultimately pinpointing the individual who used the gun to commit a particular crime.
During the investigation of the recent Virginia Tech incident, ATF provided the Virginia State Police (VSP) with trace information that allowed the VSP to determine where and from whom Seung-Hui Cho purchased the two handguns he used in the shootings. Firearms trace information was also used to solve a theft of 22 firearms from a security service in Atlanta that were subsequently purchased by an undercover police officer on the streets of New York.
ATF considers this information law-enforcement-sensitive because it is often the first investigative lead in a case. We treat it no differently than fingerprint matches and other crime-scene information, since disclosure outside of law enforcement can tip off criminals to the investigation, compromise cases and endanger the lives of undercover officers, witnesses and confidential sources.
Our agency routinely shares trace data with state and local law-enforcement agencies in support of investigations within their respective jurisdictions. Once a requesting agency receives law-enforcement-sensitive trace data from ATF, it becomes the agency's data to disseminate and share with other law-enforcement entities as it deems appropriate.
Let me be clear: neither the congressional language nor ATF rules prohibit the sharing of trace data with law enforcement conducting criminal investigations, or place any restrictions on the sharing of trace data with other jurisdictions once it is in the hands of state or local law enforcement. In fact, multi-jurisdictional trace data is also utilized by ATF and shared with fellow law-enforcement agencies to identify firearm-trafficking trends and leads. Additionally, nothing prohibits ATF from releasing our own reports that analyze trace-data trends that could be used by law enforcement.
ATF has a proud tradition of supporting its law-enforcement partners at every level of government. We will continue to provide them with the information they need to protect our communities from individuals who would use firearms to further illegal activity. Congress has recognized ATF's crucial role in that investigative process and has protected our ability to share that sensitive data with law enforcement. The restriction did nothing more than to codify ATF's longstanding policy of sharing trace data with other law-enforcement agencies for the purpose of conducting a criminal investigation.
Our priority will continue to be to release trace data in a manner consistent with our longstanding policy, and to support the over 17,000 federal, state, local and foreign law-enforcement agencies that avail themselves of this crucial tool.
(Michael J. Sullivan is acting director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF), U.S. Department of Justice.)
http://www.scrippsnews.com/node/22041
Tiahrt DOES NOT tie the hands of law enforcement AT ALL.
ReplyDeleteThat's not a matter that's up for debate. It simply does not restrict access to trace data for law enforcement purposes in any way. To claim that it does is a lie.
Sadly, Sullivan was a political and temporary appointee of the Bush admin. and no longer speaks for the ATF.
ReplyDeleteIn fact, if you speak to the ATF , today, they will tell you the Tiahrt Amend serves only one purpose: to protect criminals who commit crimes with guns.
As it stands now, the ATF cannot investgate suspected crimes by gun dealers thanks to the Tiahrt Amendment.
--JadeGold
How did they know where any of the crime guns game from if Tiahart would not let law enforcement trace them?
ReplyDeleteMikeB, you really need to admit it and move on: Tiahart does not interfere with law enforcement investigations.
http://www.abanet.org/poladv/letters/crimlaw/2007may07_commerceapproph_l.pdf
ReplyDeleteDear Chair Mollohan and Ranking Member Frelinghuysen:
Your Subcommittee will soon consider Fiscal Year 2008 appropriations recommendations for the Departments of Commerce, Justice, Science, and Related Agencies. On behalf of the American Bar Association, I am writing to urge your support for striking language known collectively as the “Tiarhrt Amendments,” legislative riders that have been attached to annual U.S. Department of Justice appropriations bills for the last four years.
The Tiahrt Amendment provisions unduly hamstring the ability of federal, state and local law enforcement to investigate many types of gun crimes. The current language prohibits the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (ATFE) from using appropriated funds to share or disclose crime gun trace data except in the narrow connection with a particular law enforcement investigation and then only information that pertains to the geographic jurisdiction of the law enforcement agency involved may be shared. The Tiahrt Amendment prevents ATFE from releasing broader crime gun trace or data regarding multiple sales – often a leading indicator pointing to illegal gun trafficking – to the public or even fellow law enforcement agencies in the states or localities. ATFE is also prohibited from disclosing data in response to civil litigation discovery requests. These restrictions were added to previous appropriations bills without a separate floor vote or debate.
The Tiahrt Amendment provisions severely restrict and hamper coordination of law enforcement investigations and public scrutiny of illegal gun trafficking. ATFE clearly stated in its 2000 Report, Commerce in Firearms in the United States, that the collection and dissemination of this crime gun data is needed for effective law enforcement strategies aimed at illegal gun trafficking. Its analysis of crime gun traces and multiple sales reports led to development of series of “gun trafficking indicators” that most often have been found linked to particular corrupt firearm dealers, including: multiple crime guns traced to a federal firearms licensee(FFL) or first retail purchaser; significant or frequently reported firearms thefts or losses by an FFL; frequent multiple sales of handguns by an FFL or multiple purchases of firearms by a non-licensee, combined with crime gun traces; short time-to-crime for crime guns traced to an FFL or first time retail purchaser; and incomplete trace results, due to an unresponsive FFL or other causes.
We agree with the over 150 Mayors and the overwhelming majority of law enforcement organizations that have called for repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment. We urge the Subcommittee to strike the collective four-years of legislative riders and restore ATFE authority to use crime gun tracing data to combat illegal gun trafficking.
Sincerely,
Denise A. Cardman
Acting Director
--JadeGold
Thanks for the excellent post FishyJay. It doesn't get much clearer than that.
ReplyDeleteWhy can't gun controllers put this issue to bed after reading the ATF director's letter?
-TS
Jadegold said: in fact, if you speak to the ATF , today, they will tell you the Tiahrt Amend serves only one purpose: to protect criminals who commit crimes with guns.
ReplyDeleteJadeGold, that is interesting. Can you please point us to the statements from Director Kenneth Melson that back your statement up?
"In fact, if you speak to the ATF , today, they will tell you the Tiahrt Amend serves only one purpose: to protect criminals who commit crimes with guns."
ReplyDeleteJade, I'll ask for a cite but as usual I am sure you don't have one since most of your garbage is created in your silly little mind.
Myth, Urban Legend, didn't happen.
Great history of Badger Guns here:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/80512802.html
This really shows the gunloons are on the side of criminals.
--JadeGold
RuffRidr: "JadeGold, that is interesting. Can you please point us to the statements from Director Kenneth Melson that back your statement up?"
ReplyDeleteJadeGold was challenged to do that on HuffPo, and of course could not do so. So Jadegold now frames it as a hypothetical that he cannot show ever actually happened: "if (IF) you speak to the ATF, today, they will tell you..."
If any ATF official had actually said so, the newspapers would have run stories saying "Obama Renews Tiahrt Despite Opposition from BATF."
RuffRidr: "JadeGold, that is interesting. Can you please point us to the statements from Director Kenneth Melson that back your statement up?"
ReplyDeleteJadeGold was challenged to do that on HuffPo, and of course could not do so. So Jadegold now frames it as a hypothetical that he cannot show ever actually happened: "if (IF) you speak to the ATF, today, they will tell you..."
If any ATF official had actually said so, the newspapers would have run stories saying "Obama Renews Tiahrt Despite Opposition from BATF."
JadeGold: "As it stands now, the ATF cannot investgate suspected crimes by gun dealers thanks to the Tiahrt Amendment."
ReplyDeleteAn incredible misunderstanding of the Tiahrt Amendment. The ATF can investigate suspected crimes by gun dealers all they want. Even JadeGold's ABA link does not show otherwise.
Tiahrt says ATF cannot share their investigative data with those who do not show a specific need.
The ABA is against a law that makes it harder to sue businesses?
ReplyDeleteWhouda thunk it?
"Do you think Milwaukee Police Chief Edward Flynn is one of those deluded gun control nuts who are afraid of inanimate objects?"
ReplyDeleteNo. He's just a deluded gun control nut.
"Great history of Badger Guns here:
http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/80512802.html
This really shows the gunloons are on the side of criminals."
Way to dodge the issue.
Jadegold, so are you conceding that Tiahrt does not restrict law enforcement with your link to the Badger guns report? From your link:
ReplyDelete"2009: MPD launches undercover mission, pulling over customers outside Badger Guns; finds felons frequent store and releases ATF data showing Badger Guns sells most crime guns traced in Milwaukee."
I’ll repeat that: “MPD… releases ATF data showing Badger Guns sells most crime guns traced in Milwaukee.” That is local law enforcement using AFT trace data, and choosing to release it to the public.
-TS
This really shows the gunloons are on the side of criminals.
ReplyDeleteI guess the ATF and the FOP are as well since both of them support Tiahrt.
Jadegold: No source for your statement then? Didn't think so as I doubt one exists.
ReplyDeleteThis really shows the gunloons are on the side of criminals.
Where exactly in the article does it show that? Also, what does this have to do with trace data and the Tiahrt Amendment?
Jade,
ReplyDelete1. What does any of that have to do with Tiahart? Most of it pre-dates Tiahart.
2. I am still waiting on a cite from your earlier nonsense in this thread.
3. And I will also need to caution you again on using my trademark or referencing my domain name.
And once again when challenged, Jadegold fails to provide a source for statements that he/she made up out of thin air.
ReplyDeleteJade's a proven liar, why would anyone expect him to start being truthful now?
ReplyDelete