Left side
"The end of democracy and the defeat of the American Revolution will occur when government falls into the hands of lending institutions and moneyed incorporations."Right Side
"The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not."Both are not really quotations from Jefferson, while the right's version is obviously false. Let's face it, Jefferson was a slave owner: talk about taking from people who work for a living without proper compensation!
The exact quotation used by the Left also has not been found in the writings of Thomas Jefferson. It may be a mistaken amalgamation of the author's comments in the above 1994 reference with a real Jefferson quotation. Jefferson wrote in 1825 to William Branch Giles of "vast accession of strength from their younger recruits, who having nothing in them of the feelings or principles of ’76 now look to a single and splendid government of an Aristocracy, founded on banking institutions and monied in corporations under the guise and cloak of their favored branches of manufactures commerce and navigation, riding and ruling over the plundered ploughman and beggared yeomanry."
This gets to what exactly were the real reasons for the American War for Independence? If it was based upon free trade and an end to monopolies (i.e. The British East India Company), then the legacy would be one which is more left leaning than the current right wing appropriation of the "Tea Party" title would have us believe.
The problem with the period of the War of Independence is that it has become part of the US National myth. It is romanticised and not seen in its proper historical context. Instead of creating a utopia, it created anarchy and economic ruin which was only fixed by the adoption of the Constitution.
People need to reassess that period of Early American history in a new light. I would hope that it would help extinguish the insurrectionist nonsense that has become common which none of the founders would tolerate.
The Jefferson quote these gun loons use is the one that implies we must overthrow the government by violence (blood violence) every once in a while. They use this Jefferson quote to not only justify violent overthrow of government, but it's something we must do every once in a while. Just one reason I call them gun LOONS.
ReplyDeleteIndeed.
DeleteDoes anyone seriously believe the Founders advocated the violent overthrow of the Govt they themselves created? If someone does, they ought to read that pesky section in the Constitution about treason.
ReplyDeleteAnd included in the Constitution about are the founders writings about government treason the peoples right to throw off such a government and create a new one if needed.
DeleteNot in any US Constitution on this planet.
DeleteWell said Jadegold. While some of the founding fathers bloviated about overthrow of government, by the time the Articles of Confederation (and perpetual unity- not) had failed, they thoroughly abandoned such nonsense. When Jefferson wrote about overthrowing the govt. from France, his words were BROADLY CONDEMNED as ridiculous and dangerous by the remaining founding fathers.
DeleteWe have idiot extremists again this election cycle, like Joni Ernst in Iowa (who still believes there are WMDs in Iraq and other conspiracy theory junk) who is taking up the standard for resorting to insurrection if the radical righties don't get their way in the election, from the failed idiot in Nevada, Sharron Angles, and her bullet box / ballot box nonsense.
What I especially appreciate about Laci's post is his ability to pick up on what is and is not legitimate period language, and his grasp of what the actual positions were of historical figures, in contrast to the right wingers who try to hijack the founding fathers to give their sick, sad ideology some kind of authenticity. They fail.
Good job Laci!
"Not in any US Constitution on this planet."
DeleteNot in the Constitution itself but in the founders writings, the reasons for parts of the Constitution being written the way it is.
" While some of the founding fathers bloviated about overthrow of government" and "When Jefferson wrote about overthrowing the govt"
Thank you doggone for touching on the minor points of the founders writings, even tho with omissions and twisting, still proves my point.
All the founders wrote their opinions and reasoning for the wording of the Constitution and were kept for the judging of it. Explanations, if you will for the laws set fourth.
Of course its your opinion, doggone, about Laci's abilities to render an opinion honestly. It has been the opinion that Laci has been wrong more times than not and not just by right wingers or gun nuts. Laci has repeatedly hijacked and twisted the founders writings and were found such by numerous lawyers and judges.
Anonymous October 27, 2014 at 9:57 PM
Delete"And included in the Constitution about are the founders writings about government treason the peoples right to throw off such a government and create a new one if needed."
But you said it was included in the Constitution?
"Not in the Constitution itself but in the founders writings, the reasons for parts of the Constitution being written the way it is."
But now you say it's not in the Constitution.
I did, didn't I. My bad. My bad for making not making it more clear. I should have said it this way;
DeleteAnd along with the Constitution are the founders writings about government treason the peoples right to throw off such a government and create a new one if needed.
All the founders wrote their opinions and reasoning for the wording of the Constitution and were kept for the judging of it. Explanations, if you will for the laws set fourth.
Gee, a gun loon caught lying, what a surprise.
DeleteHey, good news, no need for a violent overthrow. Governments fall apart on their own. It is just history repeating itself. We've done pretty good. Compare us to Nazi Germany or Communist USSR. How about Italy?
ReplyDeleteBut, the good old USA is headed down the road to ruin under its own weight. These are exciting times to watch it right before our eyes. It is sorta like the point in ones life when they realize they have more good days behind them than in front of them.
You might as well grab a beer, sit back and be a spectator to the fall of the empire. What a great time to be alive.
orlin sellers
You sound like a candidate for ISIS recruitment. Hate America much, Orlin?
DeleteApparently you haven't figured it out yet, the government is not the country.
Deleteorlin sellers
Orlon Fluff-for-brains, you have taken up the mantle of the blessedly long gone Campy as the dumbest, most ill-informed and nutty commenter on Mikeb's blog. You are an unmitigated idiot.
DeleteAnd no, despite your desperate hopes, your side of radical regressive extremists are losing, and that is a GREAT thing for this country going forward.
And No, while the government is not the whole country, the government is the representative of the country, which in some respects (not all) amounts to the same thing.
Great smear. No substance as usual though from the vagitarian.
ReplyDeleteGreat mental masturbation though when you say the government is not the whole country...and then say it is.
So 'the land of 10,000 beaches' is actually the government or the city of Los Angeles is the government.
Don't you embarrass yourself enough on your own blog?
your friend,
orlin sellers