Whereas the NRA would have us believe that the solution to our alarming homicide rate is more good-guy guns and greater accessibility, that argument has been refuted beyond dispute when it comes to suicide. A recent landmark review by the Harvard School of Public Health begins with, "Every study that has examined the issue to date has found that within the U.S., access to firearms is associated with increased suicide risk." Based on hard scientific data, the unanimous verdict is in. Period.
From a multitude of statistics, I will cite a few that seem especially revealing:
- In rural America, where guns are a far more accessible part of the culture, people ages 10-24 are twice as likely as their urban counterparts to commit suicide, overwhelmingly by gunfire.
- 1.1 million people attempted suicide in the U.S. in 2012. A suicide attempt by gunfire is nearly always fatal. Only one in sixty suicide attempts by all other means combined is fatal.
- A 2012 study found that suicide has surpassed auto accidents as the leading cause of injury-related death in the U.S. Gunfire is the fastest growing method.
- A 2007 study compared 39 million people from the 15 states with the highest gun ownership versus 40 million people from the 6 states with the lowest gun owner prevalence. There were 9,749 firearm suicides from the high-prevalence states versus 2,606 from the low-prevalence states. Both groups had approximately 5,000 or so non-firearm suicides.
- The oft-quoted study of sweeping gun control regulation in Australia, following the 1996 mass murder of 35 people by a lone gunman, resulted in a 65 percent annual drop in suicides by gunfire with no increase in suicide by other methods. A successful gun buy-back program reduced the rate still further by as much as 74 percent. These results only slightly exceed the drop in homicides by gunfire (59 percent), again with no increase in homicide by other methods.
It took you six months to find this article? Well, let's be reminded of some things:
ReplyDelete1. http://www.suicidology.org/c/document_library/get_file?folderId=262&name=DLFE-630.pdf
These are the suicide rates by region in 2010. The national average is 12.4 per 100,000. Note that the region including Virginia, West Virginia, and Pennsylvania is below the average. The one from Louisiana and Arkanasas to New Mexico--including Texas--is 12.8, only slightly above the average. Ohio to Minnesota is also below average, despite what Garrison Keillor would have us believe.
2. Comparing the highest fifteen states with the lowest six is a curious choice, unless the authors were hoping to get a particular result. It would make more sense to rank all states by rates of gun ownership in decreasing order and then all states by suicide rates.
3. I see no attempt being made to control for economic factors in the comparison of those states.
4. We're provided data about Australia, but conveniently, nothing is mentioned about Japan, Canada, and Ireland. Again, comparisons seem to be done with an eye to a desired result.
Even if true--and I notice that Dr. Tansey says not a word about Japan, where private ownership of guns is as close to zero as a forcible citizen disarmament freak could hope for, and where the suicide is dramatically higher than in the U.S.
ReplyDeleteBesides, a person's life belongs to that person, who therefore has every right to terminate it when he or she wishes.
Japan is a loser for your side. Haven't you been paying attention?
Deletehttp://mikeb302000.blogspot.it/2012/12/suicides-in-japan.html
We've been paying attention, Mikeb. We've seen you making wild assertions with no support for a long time. We've seen you reject evidence and fail to comprehend data analysis. Japan is evidence to support our side.
DeleteGee Mike, you claim that social culture drives suicide rates (and not gun ownership), and then say it’s a “loser for our side”?
DeleteSuicide has never been criminalized in Japan
Is it a crime here? Has anyone ever been sentenced to prison for the crime of attempted suicide?
Completely missing are the samurai warriors and the kamakaze pilots, the centuries of art and literature that elevate the act of suicide to something absolutely foreign to Americans.
It’s pretty foreign to the Hungarians, Russians, Lithuanians, and French to (to name a few). How come they all have much higher suicide rates than we do?
I’ll shamelessly quote myself from that thread:
Totally lacking in Japanese culture is the honorable notion of murder which has always been so prevalent in American gang culture. Completely missing are the turf killings, the payback killings, the initiation killings, the anti-snitching killings, that elevate the act of murder to something absolutely foreign to the Japanese.
And of course you explained this away by saying murder is a result of “gun availability”, and suicide is a result of culture… well, only for the Japanese that is.
"For suicidal people, access to guns is lethal; access to mental health care is life-saving. Similarly, access to guns increases the risk of homicide. But in stark contrast, expanding mental health services with the goal of profile-predict-and-prevent, essentially for the purpose of psychiatric incarceration, will make matters far worse."
ReplyDeleteActually Mike, this seems more like someone making an argument against one of the President's steps against gun violence where he urges the health community to report more people so they're guns can be confiscated. (for their own good of course)
He brings up a good point here when he talks of one of his patients,
"Had I rushed to the phone to report him to the authorities, the therapy would have been over, his anger would have become much worse, and any propensity for actual violence would have been exacerbated."
As I said here many times, there is a correlation between gun ownership and total suicide rates at the state level. That's just a correlation, not causation. Suicide rates also correlate to a lot of other things (like rural vs. urban, and race). It doesn't correlate internationally, however, as most of those awesome countries that you guys tout for their rights violations have higher suicide rates than the US. In fact, Australia is right there with the USA (a touch lower), something which this article omits intentionally leaving their readers with the impression that people must off themselves not nearly as often down under. Is that part of the "lies, guns, and suicide" that you referred to?
ReplyDeleteThe problem with these arguments presented by gun rights folks is that they deny the facts. Suicide accounts for most of the gun deaths in America. That is because we have more guns in private hands than any other country not at war and we make them easily accesible to people who shouldn't have them. When guns are so available, sitting around loaded in homes, they will get used. When they are so easy to buy with or without a background check, it is easy to end one's misery, or whatever is causing a very bad day, to end in senseless and preventable tragedy. We live in the U.S. So the argument that Japan has a high rate of suicide by other methods should mean we shouldn't do anything about our suicide by gun rate? Such nonsense doesn't hold up under scrutiny. We can and should do something about this problem. The fact that the gun guys don't want to is pretty sick and inexplicable.
ReplyDeleteJoan,
DeleteYou are not a regular commenter here and never engage with the rest of us, but you come here and leave presents on the rug telling us how we constantly lie and distort the facts.
If you feel like backing up that comment and showing how our arguments here are based on lying, go right ahead. Or you can just skip that and engage us on the actual terms of our arguments.
Just don't think it makes you look smart to ignore the conversation and just drop gems like this here, talking about how gun rights people, as a generic group, are supposedly such awful people.
But we don't have the highest suicide rate of any country not at war. It's not even close.
DeleteIt seems what the gun control movement does regarding suicides is to run informational campaigns saying, "don't by a gun because you might use it to commit suicide", to which a potential buyer can say, "thanks, I'll take that under advisement". You usually like to bring the force of law into it, so what exactly do you propose? Criminal background checks don't have anything to do with it, and you're not going to ban all guns from everyone to protect them from themselves, right?
"So the argument that Japan has a high rate of suicide by other methods should mean we shouldn't do anything about our suicide by gun rate?"
ReplyDeleteThat isn't what anyone is saying. However, much like the gun crime problems in Chicago not being controlled by strict gun laws, the implementing of strict gun laws to try to control suicide isn't necessarily the best solution. As the author stated so well, current practice is very effective in keeping people in distress from making that final irreversible step.
There are likely many more effective ways to affect incidences in suicide including those not involving guns. However trying to introduce rules that providers have to follow that would have an adverse effect on the provider/client relationship isn't one of them.
Actually, as we've discussed recently, Chicago would be far worse if not for the strict gun laws.
DeleteProper gun control including screening and qualifying for gun ownership would have a positive effect on the suicide rates.
Yes, we discussed and rejected that assertion, Mikeb. Again, you believe it, but there's no evidence to support it.
DeleteActually, as we've discussed recently, Chicago would be far worse if not for the strict gun laws.
DeleteIs that really "as we've discussed," or "as you've asserted, without evidence"?
There's also a correlation between high altitude and high suicide rates. Perhaps we should ban living in the mountains.
ReplyDeleteTell you what. I'm perfectly willing to dispense with any and all references to other countries if the pro-gun control folks will agree to do the same...and actually do it. My experience, both here and elsewhere, has been one of being assured other countries were "off the table" only to be blindsided by references to them shortly thereafter. I worked in mental health for years and I've never suggested nothing should be done about our suicide rate. I do suggest the presupposition that further gun control is the answer (as your comments seem to suggest) ignores both constitutional and mental health realities.
ReplyDelete"the presupposition that further gun control is the answer (as your comments seem to suggest)"
DeleteI don't think anyone is saying "further gun control is THE answer." It's part of the answer.
Clearly I shouldn't write when I'm tired. Let me try again. The belief that gun control has the power to reduce suicide is not supported by the research I've read. Remember, the means is chosen after the decision to end one's life.
DeleteNow, there are some questions and comments regarding the above quoted bullet points.
First bullet. Did the study distinguish between those who commit suicide and those who attempt it? This question is vital because it starts us in the direction of looking at mental health issues. The mental health issues involved are vital if our goal is to know why people attempt suicide. They are less important if our goal is to prove the conclusions we've already drawn.
Second bullet. Combining all other methods of attempting suicide tends to dilute the overall lethality. There are a number of virtually "foolproof" methods of committing suicide, aside from firearms.
Third bullet. This points to the mental health aspect. The sentence at the end begs the question.
Fourth bullet. I'd have to see the original study, but the design seems a little odd. At least as far as the bullet point is concerned, it gives the impression that the study may have been more than a little biased.
Fifth bullet. I'm trying to stick with a decision I've made to avoid discussing other countries. I'd appreciate it if people would avoid the temptation to assume I have no questions/points regarding other countries. Please, don't yell "gotcha!"
"Every study that has examined the issue to date has found that within the U.S., access to firearms is associated with increased suicide risk." And, of course, "Based on hard scientific data, the unanimous verdict is in. Period.". Both of these are specious nonsense.
ReplyDeleteIt is true that access to a lethal means increases the likelihood of a successful suicide attempt by those who attempt suicide. However, none of the studies I've read have provided evidence to support the contention that the presence of a firearm increases one's likelihood of attempting suicide,absent the factors that are otherwise associated with such attempts. There are no readily accessible means of committing suicide that have the power to increase a person's likelihood of making an attempt. As a real life example, the CRNA (Certified Registered Nurse Anesthetist) I knew who started a "hep lock" IV on himself, used his access to the med locker to lift the meds he wanted, mixed a bag of Brompton Cocktail, connected the bag to his IV and then opened the bag and drifted off to sleep did not kill himself because of his access to lethal medications. Nor did his access to them increase the likelihood he would attempt suicide. Rather, once he made the decision to kill himself he chose the means.