Fox News
Sometimes it seems the pro gun folks are against anything that might increase gun safety. They oppose it first, then come up with reasons why. For example, first they might say this.
“This is dangerous and invasive,” wrote Levi Russell in a review of the app. “Dangerous because it allows criminals to determine where they might steal firearms….you are an accomplice to any firearm theft that will occur due to the existence of this app.”
Then they might say this.
Whether an app or online, publishing the addresses of gun owners is a risky proposition, experts warn.
“This makes those who don't have guns an easier target for criminals. It’s a safety issue,” John Lott, gun expert and author of the book "More Guns, Less Crime," told FoxNews.com.
It doesn't much matter if the objections make sense or even if they contradict each other. Objecting is what's important.
What's your opinion? Please leave a comment.
A new Android app asks users to expose the home addresses of gun owners they deem “potentially unsafe” -- and share that information with the world.
ReplyDeleteI guess this asks the proverbial question, do you know who your friends are? Because that is exactly what the app is asking people to do.
While the app's website starts out with the following caveat,
"In general, you should not worry about firearms owned by either hunters or gun enthusiasts who safely store and properly enjoy their weapons in the field, or at local firing ranges for recreational purposes. These are normally the people who have the highest level of commitment to gun safety, and abide by the laws regulating their hobby. The same holds true for most concealed carry permit holders, or other owners permitted and properly regulated."
It then get into area that move into people's perceptions and asks them to use the following categories when marking a location,
•“Possible unlocked/loaded/unsafe storage”
•“Possible insufficient training”
•“Guns and unsupervised children”
•“Guns and substance abuse”
•“Possible medical related concern”
•“Neighborhood talk, unsafe”
•“Possible high conflict, armed neighbor”
•“Possible out of place, large arsenal”
•“Documented/frequent unlawful discharge”
•“Possible illegal weapons on premises”
•“Possible prohibited persons”
•“Possible anti-government/terror threat”
•“Other concern (describe)”
And of course the owners of the site show their true colors in the last,
"Without the congress taking concrete action to enact reasonable laws to reduce gun violence, there remain few alternatives but to take matters into our own hands. The Walkingtools Gun Geo Marker seeks to provide a simple, easy to use service at no charge. But we can all look forward to a future time when this tool is no longer necessary. Congress will eventually do the right thing and send reasonable reform bills to the President, thus at some point this App may be removed from circulation. But in the mean time:"
Keep in mind, that the information posted on this app really has no way to check the validity of any of the information posted. As the website well states,
"All site markings are the responsibility of users whose anonymity is protected by this software. There is no way for anyone to check the veracity of marked sites beyond living in and understanding your own neighborhood, and using your experience there to determine if a mark makes sense or not."
Looking at this another way, it would be quite simple to monkey-wrench such an app. Perhaps mark the White House as, •“Possible out of place, large arsenal. A shame it is only on android app, it could be a bit of fun.....
Again, when you throw out one right, no other right is safe. Have you heard of privacy, Mikeb? I tell you what, put skin where your mouth is. Post your name, home address, work address and title. What will be your reaction to that request? First, you'll refuse. Then you'll accuse me of making a false equivalence. Next you'll tell us we don't have the right to know that information about someone who's trying to take away what isn't really a right after all. Finally, you'll say fuck you.
ReplyDeleteSo, when we throw out the right to privacy, in this very narrow way, what happens exactly? What happens to the other rights? Do they disappear somehow?
DeleteAs I said...
DeleteThere is no constitutional right to gun ownership privacy.
DeleteThis is useful to all those families who want to keep their kids safe from neighbors who are either not responsible, especially those who do not practice safe gun storage.
In those states that do not mandate such storage, this is particularly significant for people to know before letting their kids visit those homes.
In Minnesota, where we supposedly have such stringent requirements, there have been multiple gun incidents at in-home child care operators. And of course, the incidents of children shooting other children, while 'playing', nationally is huge -- and in MN, we have had not one but two recent convictions for concealed carry permittees who did not safely store their firearms, resulting in child deaths.
So the idea that this is an issue where privacy is more important than preventing kid deaths is just one more instance of the utterly failed values and just plain sick priorities of the gun huggers -- and of course, their failed logic as well.
Dog Gone, you love that line about failed logic, but you consistently fail to show how our logic isn't working. Our right to privacy--and I mean all of us, regardless of gun ownership--is a basic human right. For you to say that around two hundred deaths per annum is sufficient to throw out privacy shows how little you care about any right.
DeleteBut as with the other gun control freaks here, I challenge you to post your name, home address, and so forth for our inspection. After all, you've carried a gun, right? How are we to know that you're not still armed? How are we to know that you store your gun in a politically correct manner? What you say counts for nothing. We need to check.
Mike, are you really ok with an app that marks homes with "unlocked guns" as a reason? And do you really think this will curb the flow of guns to the criminal world, and not aid it?
ReplyDeleteWhat I'm not OK with is the nonchalance with which you gun owners are treated when you fuck up with your precious guns. This app is a response to that.
DeleteHow, exactly, is some stranger to determine whether a gun owner's guns are locked up or not? Is there an app for breaking and entering?
DeleteSo the response is to make the criminal gun flow worse?
Delete"Looking at this another way, it would be quite simple to monkey-wrench such an app. Perhaps mark the White House as, •“Possible out of place, large arsenal. A shame it is only on android app, it could be a bit of fun....."
ReplyDeleteThat was my initial thought as well. How long before every member of MAIG had there house and/or office listed on this app? Every army base, political gun ban supporter, etc.
Also, they better be careful what marker they choose to use as an indicator in the app. Circles tend to look like targets and it could be argued that this app was creating a "hit list" of gun owners that needed to be taken out. Seems someone else recently got into trouble for that...
Other concern (describe): this house is safe. The occupants have no guns and do not support self-defense law.
ReplyDeleteTo my point above, we can argue about how many people support gun control vs. gun rights, but one thing you can't deny is that the amount of "new media" participation from our side is at least ten fold then that of yours. Number of blogs, comments on blogs and news articles (even liberal sites like huffington post), all heavily skew to pro-rights. Call it "more passion" of you don't want to call it more numbers, but the result is that 90 some
ReplyDeletepercent of the users of the app won't be their intended market. It will either be useless, or turned into pro-gun.
Other than that, how cool is it to have an app where you get to expose your neighbor's "anti-government" views. Communism in the 21st century!
Naturally the NRA and you gun extremists turn any attempt at reducing gun violence into some sort of gun rights issue.
ReplyDeleteInstead, you should applaud this technology. Every gun crime and shooting that happens works only to reduce the public opinion on guns. Thus, it is in your best interest to find ways to reduce the availability of guns to those who shouldn't have them and to, as this app does, identify those who are dangerous. Naturally you won't do this, and you'll watch as, year by year, the number of homes with guns reduces, and you are ever more sidelined as the fringe group that you are.
Post your home address, work address, telephone number, and so forth. If you think that giving out private information like that is acceptable, put your convictions where your mouth is.
DeleteBaldr, this isn't really an attempt to reduce gun violence. It's a political statement. Go to the website and read their statement.
DeleteAll information is posted anonymously, it isn't verified, and after a period of time it goes away. And it even states you need to rely on your knowlege of the area to determine whether the information is accurate.
How are those two resons contradicting exactly? They're both correct if you ask me. This app does both point out where criminals can go to steal themselves a gun, and where they can go and burglarize without fear of being stopped. Your logic is flawed and your mindset is disturbing.
ReplyDelete