Monday, July 9, 2012

Hug Causes Off-Duty Cop's Gun to Fire, Killing Woman

Anyone still want to talk about how guns don't kill people?  How about those of you who want to tell us how safe it is for people to carry firearms - that there isn't a significant risk to the rest of us that outweighs the fact you don't NEED to carry, you just get jazzed about the idea of having lethal force with you?

THIS is precisely why people like the example Laci provided do not want gun nuts who are carrying - open or concealed - on their property. Period.

It doesn't matter how convinced you are that you don't present a danger to us all.  You DO present dangers to us, clearly.  You have accidents.  You do stupid things; the stupidity escalates exponentially when alcohol is involved.  Or competition, particularly for something ego-related.  You aren't NEARLY as safe as you claim you are.  Your judgment is not superior to anyone else's - therefore your judgment is too damned flawed to be making lethal decisions for or about other people.

And there is absolutely NO evidence whatsoever that you make anyone safer - not us, not yourselves - or that you do shit about reducing crime.

All you do is make a lot of money for the gun manufacturers who own the NRA - not just regular green money, but bloody, dirty money stained with the deaths and injuries of tens of thousands of Americans, and even more people outside our borders - like Mexico.

From Michigan WOOD Ch.8:

Woman dies during hug with officer

Detroit Police: Hug triggered officer's gun

Updated: Sunday, 08 Jul 2012, 8:13 PM EDT
Published : Sunday, 08 Jul 2012, 6:39 PM EDT

DETROIT, Mich. (WOOD) - A woman celebrating the weekend before her 25th birthday was fatally shot Sunday when she hugged an off-duty police officer while dancing at a party, causing the officer's service weapon to fire, according to police and her mother.
Adaisha Miller would have turned 25 on Monday, according to her mother, Yolanda McNair.
The shooting happened at an outdoor social gathering about 12:30 a.m., said police Sgt. Eren Stephens. It happened on the city's west side.
According to Stephens, the woman "embraced the officer from behind, causing the holstered weapon to accidently discharge." The bullet punctured Miller's lung and hit her heart, and she died at a hospital.
Stephens said the Detroit officer will remain on administrative duties while authorities investigate the shooting and report their findings to the Wayne County prosecutor. The officer's name was not released.
"For this to happen to her, whether they want to call it freak accident or mistake in judgment, it should have never happened to my child, and there's nothing I can do to get her back," McNair told WDIV-TV.
McNair said her daughter was out to mark her upcoming birthday.
"All she wanted to do was enjoy the weekend for her birthday," the mother said. "She had every right to enjoy turning 25 and look beyond that."


  1. You can't have a firearms accident if there is no firearm present.

    Although, gunloons would like to persuade us that it is still possible.

  2. That is a shame, and my prayers for her family. My prayers for the off duty police officer as well. He will have to live with this for the rest of his life.

    Having said that, I would prefer it if they let us know what kind of holster and firearm he had, and what shape they were in. Most reports on shootings never seem to tell us, and there are a lot of different holster/firearms out there. More data cannot hurt, and might actually steer people away from unsafe gear. Yes, I know, there is NO safe gear in your opinion. And before you ask (or start with the snark), no, I do not have a concealed carry permit. I am curious, and see no harm in asking questions. Would just prefer to see less hate and more information.

    1. No, there is safe gear out there, but is the average person willing to take the time and expense to make sure their gear is in top condition?

      There is a strong possibility that this was a Glock which has no specific safety. They have something they call a "safety mechanism", but one can debate how actually "safe" that system is. The Glock's passive safety system omits the manipulation of traditional on-off levers, hammers or other external safeties as found in many other handgun designs.

      IS it hate to say that firearms are deadly weapons which can result in death or serious bodily injury when used properly? Is it hate to point out that one needs to be exceptionally careful with firearms due to that nature?

    2. BTW, prayers kinda do fuck all--prevention would have been a lot more helpful.

      Someone could be alive had there not a firearm in this situation.

  3. Jim, it is a shame, but what makes it MORE of a shame is that these kinds of deaths are avoidable.

    In other countries, like the UK, but also in a number of other countries in Europe and elsewhere, the police don't routinely carry firearms, much less off duty law enforcement doing so.

    There IS safe gear, but the more exposure, the more use and the more carrying of firearms, the more there will be accidents, and mistakes. Where that carry is not really necessary, where it is just some stupid preference of someone, it is an unfair danger to everyone else - the person carrying included.

    If you characterize this as hate, you are mistaken. It is outrage, at the gun culture lunacy and delusion which thinks any of this is justifiable or makes sense.

    I believe I can fairly speak for my co-bloggers as well as my self when I say we're just plain fed up with these news items that occur so very often about gun violence where with stricter regulation and enforcement, we would have legal firearms, although possibly fewer of them, AND safer people, both regular citizens and law enforcement - and even criminals who would no longer have easy access to ready lethal force, which would reduce the harm they do.

    The answer, the solution, is not to nit pick at the kind of holster. That is focusing on the wrong factor in this and every other incident. The correct focus is on how we intelligently regulate lethal force, and a civil rule of law approach instead of vigilante attitudes.

    Simply fixing holsters would not fix the problem, Jim. I'm all for more information, but there is too little critical thinking, and too much emotion masquerading as thought. But most of all there is too much propaganda from special interests that is purely exploitive - namely the NRA as operatives for the gun industry.

  4. More information was given in our newspaper this morning and to me the claim that the gun "accidentally" went off seems far fetched. The officer says he had the gun on his hip in a holster. The woman came up from behind him and hugged him. Then the gun "accidentally" went off and managed to shoot her in the chest. How does a gun in a hip holster manage to shoot someone standing directly behind you in the chest? The angle would be all wrong for that.

  5. The official determination by the chief of police states this was an accidental discharge.

    It is possible that somehow as the woman hugged the man from behind, clothing worn over the gun and holster hooked on it, causing the soft holster - which is how it was identified - to shift.

    My question is -- why the hell would a man need to be armed while hosting a party in his own home - including drinking alcohol which appears to have been served and consumed?

    This points out AGAIN the point that having a weapon, no matter how safe you want us to think you are, is not safe, and should be restricted to those occasions where strictly necessary, not where it is optional.

    The benefits do not justify the risks.

    As to the frequency of guns firing in holsters, I suggest you do a google search, as Laci and I did yesterday. The frequency with which this occurs, and in particular one set providing 8 photos where this occurred (no surprise, an old white guy, of the crabby and flabby variety) after he shot up his wife's car after going out to breakfast armed.

    Yeah, because you never know when you might urgently need to shoot a bucket seat or your own hip. Those bucket seats are DANGEROUS goblins, all right....

    1. Not to mention the number of gun loons who go around with guns stuck in their waist bands for quicker draws.

      Like that is safe in the universe of objective reality - NOT.

    2. "The official determination by the chief of police states this was an accidental discharge."

      So the chief of police manages to say that his officer was not responsible and this was just an accident. Okay. Nothing to see here. Move along.

    3. There are still plenty of questions, including how safe are police officers with their guns and holsters.

      There is still the clear evidence that guns are NOT safe.

      How dismissive you are, how appallingly willing to dismiss this young woman's life and death.

      Without a firearm there would be no accident, and no death. Point made, point to our side. Zero and fail to yours.

  6. I'm only surprised that the Police haven't already determined that the young woman tried to grab the cop's gun and, in the process managed to load a magazine, chamber a round and shoot herself. No, really, that's what prolly happened.

    "Stupidental" shootings happen people! It's not the gunz fault or even it's owner'z fault; it's the fault of the dummies who don't know where to stand when bulletz be zoomin'!!