Can't decent countries just put the US on lock-down When are we going to address the REAL problems: Mental illness and our violence loving culture? It's pretty easy to say, 'Ban guns!' but you could ban every legal gun in the country and we'd STILL have things like this happen. Calling for a ban on guns is intellectually lazy. It just sounds so easy. If we ban guns, how are we going to convince criminals to turn them in? Trade them for Chia Pets, maybe? As long as we encourage a gangsta culture where 'capping' people is glorified, we ALL have ourselves to blame - not just the gun owners. As long as we do such a poor job of identifying and treating the mentally ill, we ALL have ourselves to blame - not just the gun owners. Until people are willing to address the causes of this kind of violence, we're just going to continue to have one side calling for gun bans and the other side saying not gonna happen and no one gets anywhere.
You make some good points, but I have to take issue with your oversimplification of the gun control agenda. It's not a simple call for banning guns. What gun control advocates want is a comprehensive set of proper gun laws which would remove firearms from unfit people and therefore directly and positively affect the situation.
Mikeb, your definition of unfit people is the phone book.
Anum, you make excellent points. Consider that our rates of violence are at their lowest levels in decades. What works is improving mental health availability, policing methods, and education.
These kinds of incidents will not stop until people like the fake professor NRA traitor Greg are rejected and the lies they spew are rejected. Greg favors taking the law into his own hands with his gun, instead of calling the police. According to the fake professor, deaths by gun shot are statistical accidents, which cannot be stopped. Background checks including mental health evaluations are (according to the fake NRA professor) unconstitutional and no form of gun, or ammunition control will help. A false, defeatist attitude that feeds the gun buying frenzy. Guns are an inanimate object, that do not fire by themselves. Negligence is why these guns fire when they are not supposed to. A gun culture promoted by the NRA and loons like the fake professor give some the mistaken worship of guns, as the only solution to any problem. Gun control efforts in the 19th century, did lower gun shot deaths. Some, like fake professor NRA Greg have not learned the lessons of American history, so we will have to relearn those lessons as we go back in time with open carry laws and those who feel they can determine what is law, by the simple death force of their guns. Statistics tell us America is a gun culture with more gun shot deaths than any other country on Earth. Fake NRA professor Greg says that is a statistical lie compared to the population of those other countries, and those "accidental" deaths must be accepted as part of legitimate statistical outcome. BS!
There are so many lies and misconceptions here that it's hard to know where to begin, but here goes:
1. My students would be amused at the thought that I'm a fake. I give them assignments. I lead class discussions. I give them grades. I get paid by the college. Where does the fake bit come in?
2. Care to provide support for your claims about the nineteenth century? The gun control laws that you may be referring to were designed to keep freed blacks from being armed, but surely that's not what you want to bring up.
3. Again, many countries have a much higher murder rate than the United States. I don't know what the breakdown of methods is for those nations, but does it matter how a person is killed? What matters is the number being killed.
4. The proposals that we see repeatedly would make owning and carrying guns exceedingly difficult for those people who abide by the law. Criminals don't bother with compliance. And since they often have connections with illegal import businesses, they'll remain armed.
As soon as you prove that I do not have a permit to carry as you and TN continually claim. I feel sorry for students who are taught by such a fanatic. I gave you an example, you had no reply. Gee, I wonder why?
I've said that I doubt your veracity on that subject due to various comments you have made. I never claimed to know, and it's not been a continual thing except for your continual references to my original comment and this, the second or third time I've responded to you on the subject.
I don't care if you have a permit or not. Given your comments here, I don't know why you would, since you reject the idea of carrying a gun as something effective or safe to do in so many contexts.
So if I'm not agreeing with YOUR idea of a good gun carrying NRA flukey, then I cannot possibly be a real permit holder. Thanks for the laugh, I needed one today.
No, I said that you've offered no explanation for why you carry, so we have no way of evaluating your claim that you do, nor do we have any reason to accept that you're a responsible gun carrier.
Gee, a real twist from the unreal professor. Go through the threads and count how many times you and your NRA buddies dodge my questions. Whatever I say you won't accept, and as usual just call me a liar. I owe you no explanation. You NRA liars aren't worth an explanation, just good for a laugh, and thanks for that.
Considering this happened in a "gun-free zone" within another basically "gun-free zone", is it any wonder more people weren't killed or wounded?
Of course, David Frum was first out of the gate jumping on the still warm bodies of the dead bleating for gun control. It also didn't take Dianne Feinstein long before she piled on, too.
This is just another case of a mentally ill person slipping through the cracks. His guns should have been removed after shooting through his ceiling in Texas because he was mad at the neighbor.
The gun-free zone lie is very popular among you gun nuts, but the Loughner shooting showed that it's just that, a lie. Loughner killed people indiscriminately until he ran out of ammo and that was NOT in a gun-free zone in Arizona where they enjoy Constitutional Carry. That means there were several people in the crowd with guns, but as often happens they were incapable of intervening.
The fact that most mass shootings happen in gun-free zones is incidental - the deranged maniacs do not choose them for their gun status but for other reasons. Usually it's about some grievance they have, like work place shootings, others are operating in obedience to the aliens who live in the attic.
Again with the unproven and unprovable claim of people in the crowd with guns--a statement that slanders an ill-defined group of survivors and shows either a lack of comprehension of the rules of statistics, or a total disregard for them in favor of making up a point.
Seems to me that you're the one who's not thinking Mike B. You are too blinded by emotion. You speculate all the time, spewing innuendo about guns and gun owners when you don't have the facts, which is most of the time.
Mike, my long-standing disagreement with Greg is about Tucson Arizona on the day of the Loughner shooting. Because there is no evidence to support the fact that there were armed gun owners in the crowd, other than the one who did come forward and was unable the help, Greg says there were none.
My idea is in a state with Constitutional Carry, at a public political gathering of hundreds, perhaps thousands of people, there were a good handful of them.
That's called using your head, on my part. And that's called hiding behind the demand for proof on Greg's.
Mikeb, you fail to recognize the distinction between speculation and proof. Many things are possible, but in the absence of evidence, we can't make definitive statements and call that logical.
Can't decent countries just put the US on lock-down When are we going to address the REAL problems: Mental illness and our violence loving culture? It's pretty easy to say, 'Ban guns!' but you could ban every legal gun in the country and we'd STILL have things like this happen. Calling for a ban on guns is intellectually lazy. It just sounds so easy. If we ban guns, how are we going to convince criminals to turn them in? Trade them for Chia Pets, maybe? As long as we encourage a gangsta culture where 'capping' people is glorified, we ALL have ourselves to blame - not just the gun owners. As long as we do such a poor job of identifying and treating the mentally ill, we ALL have ourselves to blame - not just the gun owners. Until people are willing to address the causes of this kind of violence, we're just going to continue to have one side calling for gun bans and the other side saying not gonna happen and no one gets anywhere.
ReplyDeleteRegards
Anum Hafeez
Media Manager
World News
You make some good points, but I have to take issue with your oversimplification of the gun control agenda. It's not a simple call for banning guns. What gun control advocates want is a comprehensive set of proper gun laws which would remove firearms from unfit people and therefore directly and positively affect the situation.
DeleteMikeb, your definition of unfit people is the phone book.
DeleteAnum, you make excellent points. Consider that our rates of violence are at their lowest levels in decades. What works is improving mental health availability, policing methods, and education.
These kinds of incidents will not stop until people like the fake professor NRA traitor Greg are rejected and the lies they spew are rejected.
ReplyDeleteGreg favors taking the law into his own hands with his gun, instead of calling the police. According to the fake professor, deaths by gun shot are statistical accidents, which cannot be stopped.
Background checks including mental health evaluations are (according to the fake NRA professor) unconstitutional and no form of gun, or ammunition control will help. A false, defeatist attitude that feeds the gun buying frenzy.
Guns are an inanimate object, that do not fire by themselves. Negligence is why these guns fire when they are not supposed to.
A gun culture promoted by the NRA and loons like the fake professor give some the mistaken worship of guns, as the only solution to any problem.
Gun control efforts in the 19th century, did lower gun shot deaths. Some, like fake professor NRA Greg have not learned the lessons of American history, so we will have to relearn those lessons as we go back in time with open carry laws and those who feel they can determine what is law, by the simple death force of their guns.
Statistics tell us America is a gun culture with more gun shot deaths than any other country on Earth. Fake NRA professor Greg says that is a statistical lie compared to the population of those other countries, and those "accidental" deaths must be accepted as part of legitimate statistical outcome. BS!
There are so many lies and misconceptions here that it's hard to know where to begin, but here goes:
Delete1. My students would be amused at the thought that I'm a fake. I give them assignments. I lead class discussions. I give them grades. I get paid by the college. Where does the fake bit come in?
2. Care to provide support for your claims about the nineteenth century? The gun control laws that you may be referring to were designed to keep freed blacks from being armed, but surely that's not what you want to bring up.
3. Again, many countries have a much higher murder rate than the United States. I don't know what the breakdown of methods is for those nations, but does it matter how a person is killed? What matters is the number being killed.
4. The proposals that we see repeatedly would make owning and carrying guns exceedingly difficult for those people who abide by the law. Criminals don't bother with compliance. And since they often have connections with illegal import businesses, they'll remain armed.
That's enough to be getting on with.
As soon as you prove that I do not have a permit to carry as you and TN continually claim.
DeleteI feel sorry for students who are taught by such a fanatic.
I gave you an example, you had no reply. Gee, I wonder why?
I've said that I doubt your veracity on that subject due to various comments you have made. I never claimed to know, and it's not been a continual thing except for your continual references to my original comment and this, the second or third time I've responded to you on the subject.
DeleteI don't care if you have a permit or not. Given your comments here, I don't know why you would, since you reject the idea of carrying a gun as something effective or safe to do in so many contexts.
DeleteBut what is this example that you offered?
As I said in the beginning of this tiresome bickering, Jim represents the average gun owner much better than you, Greg, and you, Tennessean.
DeleteSo if I'm not agreeing with YOUR idea of a good gun carrying NRA flukey, then I cannot possibly be a real permit holder. Thanks for the laugh, I needed one today.
DeleteNo, I said that you've offered no explanation for why you carry, so we have no way of evaluating your claim that you do, nor do we have any reason to accept that you're a responsible gun carrier.
DeleteGee, a real twist from the unreal professor. Go through the threads and count how many times you and your NRA buddies dodge my questions. Whatever I say you won't accept, and as usual just call me a liar. I owe you no explanation. You NRA liars aren't worth an explanation, just good for a laugh, and thanks for that.
DeleteConsidering this happened in a "gun-free zone" within another basically "gun-free zone", is it any wonder more people weren't killed or wounded?
ReplyDeleteOf course, David Frum was first out of the gate jumping on the still warm bodies of the dead bleating for gun control. It also didn't take Dianne Feinstein long before she piled on, too.
This is just another case of a mentally ill person slipping through the cracks. His guns should have been removed after shooting through his ceiling in Texas because he was mad at the neighbor.
The gun-free zone lie is very popular among you gun nuts, but the Loughner shooting showed that it's just that, a lie. Loughner killed people indiscriminately until he ran out of ammo and that was NOT in a gun-free zone in Arizona where they enjoy Constitutional Carry. That means there were several people in the crowd with guns, but as often happens they were incapable of intervening.
DeleteThe fact that most mass shootings happen in gun-free zones is incidental - the deranged maniacs do not choose them for their gun status but for other reasons. Usually it's about some grievance they have, like work place shootings, others are operating in obedience to the aliens who live in the attic.
Again with the unproven and unprovable claim of people in the crowd with guns--a statement that slanders an ill-defined group of survivors and shows either a lack of comprehension of the rules of statistics, or a total disregard for them in favor of making up a point.
DeleteMikeb, you've yet to provide any evidence that anyone in the immediate crowd in Tucson had a gun. Speculation is not evidence.
DeleteKeep lying to yourselves and hiding behind the demand for evidence. Don't use your heads. Don't think, god forbid.
DeleteMikeb, it's so cute how you regard thinking and using evidence to be two different activities.
DeleteSeems to me that you're the one who's not thinking Mike B. You are too blinded by emotion. You speculate all the time, spewing innuendo about guns and gun owners when you don't have the facts, which is most of the time.
DeleteMike, my long-standing disagreement with Greg is about Tucson Arizona on the day of the Loughner shooting. Because there is no evidence to support the fact that there were armed gun owners in the crowd, other than the one who did come forward and was unable the help, Greg says there were none.
DeleteMy idea is in a state with Constitutional Carry, at a public political gathering of hundreds, perhaps thousands of people, there were a good handful of them.
That's called using your head, on my part. And that's called hiding behind the demand for proof on Greg's.
Mikeb, you fail to recognize the distinction between speculation and proof. Many things are possible, but in the absence of evidence, we can't make definitive statements and call that logical.
Delete